CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded

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RibRater
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/06 09:51:44 (permalink)
quote:
Originally posted by bassrocker4u2

i understand that the electrics are well sealed, but that may be a bad thing. the smoke, on a long cook, changes. gets stale, actually. i prefer sending in fresh stuff constantly. i guess thats what i cant get passed in my mind. i like fresh coals being added throughout the cook. plus changing up the flavors at certain intervals. but thats just me. i figure bbq is made from wood coals. somebody show me a place where i can go try this electric.....please.



bass, the cookers are well sealed but there is a hole for the smoke to escape at the top. it doesnt seal in the smoke.

the real test is in the taste (and appearance to me) of the final product. once you have some good que cooked in one of these, adding fresh coals may very well become a thing of the past for you.


#31
prisonchef
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/06 18:14:44 (permalink)
cajunking,
thanks for the kind words and i sure am glad that i helped you out just like zeb helped me. it was a combo thing since he uses a 260 and we had to modify the answer for my 150's.
bassrocker,
st augustine is a short drive from where you are. come on down and i will be more than happy to show you how to do it. just returning the favor you showed me and peggy when we visited you. but trust me the 2 to 4 ounces of wood idea is not how it will work out at all. your idea on air exchange is great but you left off the part about bark formation and crisping the skin on chicken which is also influenced by this condition.
larry,
the hole in the top of the sm150 is the key to the "whole" thing. peg's radiology training brought up the Bernoulli Effect and confirms bassrockers idea. this in fact was the crux of zeb's cure and in fact helped us beyound words.
smokinokie,
i have two boxes of wood which came with both of my SM150's. they both had the "warning" on them. in view of the fact that these came from cookshack i do not clearly understand how you can rate bassrockers statement as libelous as the heat source is not in question but merely the flavoring medium which in this case is wood. in view of the fact that an elected state govenment passed a law which requires these warnings i don't quite understand your attack on bassrocker.
#32
smokinokie
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/07 14:14:11 (permalink)
quote:
Originally posted by prisonchef

cajunking,

larry,the hole in the top of the sm150 is the key to the "whole" thing. peg's radiology training brought up the Bernoulli Effect and confirms bassrockers idea. this in fact was the crux of zeb's cure and in fact helped us beyound words.


Didn't see, what was BRs idea? Loading it up with more wood? Changing wood? Preburning wood?

Now if you meant to say Bernoulli's Principle, are you saying the difference in air pressure between inside and outside (as a former pilot I'm well aware of how BP keep me flying)? Interesting idea, we've discussed in other forums.

Hey we're all here learning, how about some details.

Maybe I just missed the idea, appreciate the help. That's me, trying to learn, asking questions about statements made, that might or might not be proven, but that get's called an attack.

Let me get this right PC, so I know your rules. Asking someone for details, stating something is cancerous and potential threat to our clients health, is an Attack? Hmm, think the attack came from you, not me asking a releavant question about health and cancer.

Maybe the pros should worry about the statement made that might impact out client, instead of someone asking for an explaination being labeled as an attack.

Cancer causing Did you all miss that statement. So now, by that statement, anyone not cooking over coals, is selling food enhanced by cancer causing agents (smoke).

That worrys me a little more than PC calling it an Attack, so my request for details in my earlier post still stands.
#33
Tom-Fl
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/08 09:20:27 (permalink)
You'll also find that in this type efficient cooker,after the initial quick burn,you'll need to pass your hand over the vent hole-to be sure it is smoking.

Like most stickburners, will also be looking for clear smoke by adjusting the air intake and letting the exhaust run wide open.

Tom
#34
bassrocker4u2
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/09 09:26:54 (permalink)

first i will post this for all to read....









What's In That Smoke?
For many the smell of wood smoke from a fireplace elicits fond memories of hearth and home. There is a lack of awareness, however, that wood smoke has become a major source of air pollution in the United States. Combustion of organic matter such as wood and yard debris releases a variety of harmful substances, including particulates, carcinogens, carbon monoxide, respiratory irritants and toxins. Many people--infants and children, pregnant women, senior citizens, and those suffering from allergies, asthma, bronchitis, emphysema, pneumonia, or other heart or lung diseases--are at risk from the pollution released by wood smoke.

Compounds released during the combustion process interfere with normal lung development and function. Indoor and outdoor air quality can be degraded significantly by the use of poorly designed, non-certified wood stoves. Poor burning processes, lack of maintenance, improper stove installation, and burning wet wood create excessive amounts of pollution. Fires left smoldering to keep a house warm during the night can also be particularly harmful. Smoldering wood burns slower and incompletely, thereby releasing more smoke and gas into the air.

Wood smoke contains tiny particles of creosote, soot, and ash that can remain airborne for up to three weeks. Small particles of solid and liquid matter suspended in the air are called particulate matter, or "PM." PM10 are those particles 10 microns or less in diameter. (In comparison, a human hair is approximately 70 microns in diameter.) PM2.5, or "fine" particulate matter, are those particles 2.5 microns or less in diameter. Inhaling fine PM causes coughing, irritation, and permanent scaring of the lungs. This type of damage decreases lung function, increases the potential for respiratory illness, and may contribute to cancer, heart disease, and changes in DNA, leading to auto-immune diseases. Because of the health threats associated with particulate air pollution, the federal government regulates all particulate matter as one of the six major air pollutants.

Particulate pollution from wood stoves is primarily produced in the winter when stagnant air and temperature inversions limit air movement. At this time smoke is unable to rise and disperse, and this pollution becomes trapped close to the ground in our breathing space. Areas with valleys and poor air circulation can be strongly affected. The small size of these particles allows them to seep into houses through closed doors and windows.

Many of the small particles from wood smoke are too small to be filtered by the nose or upper respiratory system. Therefore, they are able to penetrate deep within the lungs, and they collect in the most remote portions of the lungs called the alveoli, which are tiny air sacs where oxygen enters the blood stream. Due to their ability to evade the defenses of the body, these particles are efficient vehicles for transporting toxic gases, bacteria, and viruses into the lungs, and ultimately the blood stream. Some toxic compounds are cancer-causing and can attach to the smallest smoke particles and enter the lungs at the same time. Particulate matter can clump together, blocking tiny veins as well as invoking harmful structural and chemical changes in the lungs.

A report released by the Washington State Department of Ecology based on research conducted by the University of Washington in Seattle and the EPA in Boise, Idaho, found that indoor PM10 levels from wood smoke in homes without woodstoves can reach 50-70 percent of the outdoor PM levels. The PM released from wood heating can also cause biological mutations (chromosome defects and genetic damage) in cells of the lungs. Mutagens and carcinogens are not exactly the same and not all mutagenic substances cause cancer. Mutations brought about by wood smoke, however, potentially lead to cancer formation. In 1988 an EPA study found that biological mutations in bacteria exposed to winter air samples increased with higher concentrations of fine particulate matter and were most numerous at the times of coldest temperatures, weekends, and holidays when wood stoves were used the most.

The cancer threat from air pollution is another serious public heath concern. In 1985 the EPA started a research program to clarify the sources of air pollution and to estimate their future cancer risk (Washington State Department of Ecology 1997). Their research determined that motor vehicles and wood stoves were the major sources of particulate air pollution and associated cancer risk in the urban airsheds studied. According to the EPA, many of the substances identified in wood smoke are suspected human carcinogens or co-carcinogens. These compounds include many polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs), such as benzo(a)pyrene, and various aldehydes, alkenes, and semi-volatile organic compounds.

[For information about the health risks from exposure to air toxics. See EPA's Health Risk Assessment brochure
(see http://www.epa.gov/ttnatw01/3_90_022.html)]

Carbon monoxide is a colorless, odorless gas that is also produced when wood is burned. Once in the blood stream, it reduces the ability of blood to carry oxygen to body tissues. Respiratory toxins and irritants, including nitrogen dioxide, are also released during wood combustion. These compounds impair the respiratory system and reduce its ability to fight infection.

Wood Smoke vs. Cigarette Smoke

Although many people associate tobacco smoke with certain health risks, research indicates that second hand wood smoke has potentially even greater ability to damage health. A comparison between tobacco smoke and wood smoke using electron spin resonance revealed quite startling results (Rozenberg 2001, Wood Smoke is More Damaging than Tobacco Smoke). Tobacco smoke causes damage in the body for approximately 30 seconds after it is inhaled. Wood smoke, however, continues to be chemically active and cause damage to cells in the body for up to 20 minutes, or 40 times longer.

Some of the components in wood smoke are free radicals, which steal electrons from the body, leaving cells unstable or injured. Some of these cells may die, while others may be altered and take on different functions. These changes lead to inflammation, which causes stress on the body. EPA researchers suggest that the lifetime cancer risk from wood stove emissions may be 12 times greater than the lifetime cancer risk from exposure to an equal amount of cigarette smoke. (Rozenberg 2001, What's in Wood Smoke and Other Emissions).





#35
bassrocker4u2
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/09 09:34:03 (permalink)
now that you are aware that wood smoke particles cause all different kinds of health problems... we can continue. this is evidence that my smoker is also a huge problem, as i use more wood than the electrics. so... maybe electric aint all that bad....
its only a small step(leap) to go from 'wood smoke causing health risks', to 'wood flavored foods' causing health risks, simply because of the foods getting a direct exposure to the fine particles. not sure if a study has been done of the effects of these 'fine particles' when they are digested. that would be very interesting...
maybe all this exposure to wood smoke for the last four years, is the source of my own failing heath. hhmmmmmm......
#36
Jimeats
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/09 10:17:34 (permalink)
Thanks, You just made my day. I have an old Crawford Fortress kitchen wood stove that I've been useing for 30 years now. Love it and wouldn't think about giving it up. Air quality I'm not concerned about, I live in a house built in 1774 and have more drafts than an outhouse during a blizzard. Chow Jim
#37
BQ Matt
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/16 05:54:27 (permalink)
Maybe it's just me, but I think everyone should break out some "credentials"!

OK, I'm kidding, I know some of you folks will get the joke, and hopefully find it funny!

FWIW, I've cooked on the cookshack models 305, 350, 150, and I think the other model number is 078, and can produce great BBQ with any of them. I've also cooked on the Southern Pride rotis. units, and they produce different results. Both good, just different.

For anyone looking into purchasing a commercial unit, see if you can borrow one for a week or so. My SP distributor allowed me to do that, and with CS legendary customer service, I'm betting you could work something out with them as well.
#38
prisonchef
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/17 18:38:40 (permalink)
bq matt,
just the guy i would love some input from as you have used the sm360. could you please give me your ideas on them? i am very familiar with both the southern pride rotis and non-rotis models in a commercial setting and i am also familiar with the sm150 and fec100 in the same settings. as we are nearing the end of year two of our business plan our next order of business is purchasing property for our restaurant within the following year. i have a friend in north carolina who uses an sm260 and has helped me greatly but have never met anyone with 350 experience so any help that you could give would be greatly appreciated.
the credential thing was taken in good humor and even though i know it is not necessary to you here are mine;
1994
American Culinary Federation
St Augustine Chapter
Junior Member of the year
1995
ACF
Certified Sous Chef (written exam and professional requirements fulfilled and certification granted)
2001/2002
ACF
St Augustine Chapter
Treasurer/Vice President
2001/2002
Culinary Arts Teacher. Received The Horizon Award for;
Teacher of the year alternative schools and candidate for teacher of the year St Johns County School System
1995-1999
Sous chef at Barnett Bank executive dining room and sous chef at retreat and conference center. main responsibilites were cost control, training, menu developement and special dietary requirements. Cooking style was classic french and continental cuisines with some excursions into floribean and pan pacific styles as needed.
2000
Executive chef
1973-1992
Ceco Corp
Southeastern Region
Engineering Department Supervisor.
This position gave me the leg up which has ensured my success in the food business to this date.
2003
Left teaching to pursue BBQ.
Currently employed by a local BBQ owner that has three resturants locally. I have increased beef sales several fold due to technique. The equipment used at this venue is Southern Pride models.
I am also part owner of 2 Greyhounds....Smokin!!!! a Chapter S Florida corporation. The equipment currently in use consists of an FEC100 and two SM150 units along with a Florida certified MFD 8 x 18 foot trailer. To view pictures of this unit simply go to cookshack, click on forum, scroll down to professionals, hit search and type in 2 greyhound rig pics we hope.
And those are my professional credentials of which i am quite proud.
jack
#39
BQ Matt
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/21 04:52:38 (permalink)
Hey Prisonchef-

I was joking, but since you posted them, very impressive credentials! The joke I was making was from a topic that got everyone in an uproar on Ray Basso's forum 6 months ago or so. I figured this forum has some of the same readers and might find it funny.

Anyway, since you've cooked on the SP rotis. units, and the CS 150, was there something specific you were wondering about the 350? I've not cooked with the SP "oven" type models, just the rotis.

I'd be happy to try to answer any questions if I can.
#40
prisonchef
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/09/21 22:19:31 (permalink)
matt,
i know from my experience that the electrics tend to cook "wet". to overcome this and match the product coming out of my fec100 i added additional sugar to the rub but still wasn't real happy with the outcome. it was close but no cigar. my 260 buddy up in north carolina gave me a solution which was to lower the hood to the unit which sped up airflow. worked like a dream and after much fiddling around i was able to match the products. my question is an sm150 cooks wet and from i have heard a 260 is wetter. is the 360 on full load even wetter than that?? i truly can not see us using an fec model for heavy commercial use as i know after 3 years of using a 100 it will in no way shape or form accomodate my cooking style. i like the sm models but sure am not adverse to using an southern pride in a restaurant setting.
thanks for any help
jack
#41
bassrocker4u2
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/10/01 06:31:34 (permalink)
interesting. your electrics are wet, and my gas/wood is dry. its a constant battle for me to keep moisture in the meat. i am always putting water in pans, for moisture. perhaps a solution, it two smokers. one wet, and one dry. weird, but think about it. start out with wet(electric) smoker for 6 or seven hours, then switch meat over to a gas/wood smoker(already up to temp), for remaining 3-5 hours.
we might be on to something......
#42
John A
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RE: CS SM 150 -All positive and negative input neeeded 2006/10/02 06:45:03 (permalink)
I have a Smokin Tex for Butts & Beef and a Traeger 124 for Chicken & Ribs because of their wet vs dry characteristics.

John
#43
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