Chicago vs. New York

I've been led to believe that THE best pizzas come from these two areas. But what would make one style different/better than the other?

It seems to me that Chicago has a couple different styles but New York is known for their fold-n-eat street pizzas. Is this accurate

NY is famous for Neapolitan, but also great Margherita. Chicago is a deep-dish style.

Stuffed pizza is how I imagine true "Chicago Style" pizza. What is a Neapolitan?

Stuffed pizza is a fairly new creation round these parts (25 years or less). Pizza in the Pan, also know as Deep Dish Pizza, Pan Pizza, Chicago Style Pizza and other variations have been around much longer (post WWII, I believe). Ike Sewell, the founder of Pizzeria Uno and Pizzeria Due is credited as the creator of the pan style pizza.

Pan pizza is typically 3/4" to 1" thick with a layer of mozzarella cheese under the tomato sauce. Chosen ingredients are then placed on top of the tomato sauce.

Stuffed pizza is made more like an actual pie with a thin layer of dough on the bottom of the pan, cheese and other ingredients arranged around the crust, and then another thin crust placed on top with the tomato sauce on top of that.

Hope that clears up the difference between the two styles.

Buddy

quote:

Originally posted by desertdog

Stuffed pizza is how I imagine true "Chicago Style" pizza. What is a Neapolitan?

It is your basic thin crust pizza. In NY we also have sicilian, which is a thicker, more bread like crust.

Neapolitan means "from Naples" or "of Naples". That's where it started. Same with Neapolitan ice cream, except the 3 flavors were a little different. :)

I've had Connie's Pizza at Wrigley Field and at McCormick Place in Chicago, and it wasn't at all "deep-dish" (or particluarly good) - is this another Chicago style?

BTW, I noticed over the weekend that the Uno's in Lawrence, KS has closed.

Connie's is not "Pan" pizza. It is just regular old pizza. Not exactly thick and not cracker thin like pizza in the northeast. If Connie's pizza has a specific name or fits a particular category, I am unaware of it. Also, I would agree that Connie's pizza is somewhat overrated.

BTW, the Uno's Pizzerias that you see around the country bear no resemblance or similarity to the original location in downtown Chicago. They are merely licensers of the name "Uno's", making a vague simulation of the real thing. In fact, if you go into one of their locations and tell them you're from Chicago and want to see how they compare to the one back home, they will immediately state a disclaimer, warning you not to expect the same product served on Ohio Street west of Michigan Avenue.

Buddy

I know, Buddy - I've eaten at the one in River North & the one in Lawrence. Funny that the pizza only took about ten minutes to be served in Lawrence.

quote:

Originally posted by BuddyRoadhouse

Connie's is not "Pan" pizza. It is just regular old pizza. Not exactly thick and not cracker thin like pizza in the northeast. If Connie's pizza has a specific name or fits a particular category, I am unaware of it. Also, I would agree that Connie's pizza is somewhat overrated.

BTW, the Uno's Pizzerias that you see around the country bear no resemblance or similarity to the original location in downtown Chicago. They are merely licensers of the name "Uno's", making a vague simulation of the real thing. In fact, if you go into one of their locations and tell them you're from Chicago and want to see how they compare to the one back home, they will immediately state a disclaimer, warning you not to expect the same product served on Ohio Street west of Michigan Avenue.

Buddy

That's good to know, as I have been to Uno's here in Scottsdale and also one in Wash D.C. and really was not impressed.

please don't leave out new haven pizza- arguably better than both ny and chicago- sally's and pepe's are 100+ year old brick ovens (originally bakers ovens that became pizza ovens a long time ago) that have been churning out supreme neapolitan style pies for a LONG time- i'll take a sally's bacon pie with moz any day over just about any pizza on the planet. enjoy- frankbooth

A truly great NY style pizza is all about the crust. It's hand torst thin. The sauce is spread on top of the doe with a laddle. Then top with plenty of mozzorella(no other topping necessary)and placed in a brick or steel oven. The end result is a pizza with a very well done crust(with some burned marks) where the bottom part of the crust is dark powdery and crunchy(not buttery or bready) which gives you that perfect bite. The slices are big and when you fold it to eat you gotta lean the pointy side of the slice down to allow the grease to drip off onto the wax paper. But that's not all. We also do sicilians(corner slice recommended), and calzones. Chase any one of these with a soft cup Italian Ices or a fruit punch from the brewing juicers and it's wrap!!! Now that's how we do in NY.

That's good to know, as I have been to Uno's here in Scottsdale and also one in Wash D.C. and really was not impressed.



I believe that Uno's franchises out side of Chicago the pizza's are shipped in frozen. We have one here in Tucson (Oro Valley) and it's just not the same as in the windy city. I've never ask the manager to verify this fact but was told by other patrons. If anyone knows this to be un true please post and dis spell this claim.

I would beg to differ on either type of pizza-we have some of the best thin,stuffed and thick crust pizza in Milwaukee-and I am not talking chain restaurant..........

Luckily, I live in CT and we have some absolutely wonderful Pizza here. I have lived in Florida, Nebraska, New Jersey, California (obviously Connecticut).

I worked in Manhattan for awhile and commuted every day to NYC. The trinity for the best pizza is NY, NJ, CT. While chicago is good, pizza greatness is in that area.

An honorable mention goes to this one place on Thousand Oaks blvd in Thousand Oaks. Decent pie, name escapes me. Maybe Gheppetos?

My fav is a thin crust Margherita pizza..
Not big on thick or stuffed crusts....

quote:

Originally posted by TheHotPepper.com

NY is famous for Neapolitan, but also great Margherita. Chicago is a deep-dish style.

Yes, NYC has Neapolitan (which we just call "regular" pizza) also "Sicilian". I have never hear anyone in NYC use the word "Margherita" even though that is what is our "regular" pizza.

quote:

Originally posted by annpeeples

I would beg to differ on either type of pizza-we have some of the best thin,stuffed and thick crust pizza in Milwaukee-and I am not talking chain restaurant..........

Like Zaffiro's, maybe...

I have heard it called margherita pizza in several NY pizza places. Isn't it something to do with the cheese?

In Italy a Pizza Margarita is just lightly seasoned diced tomatoes, "real" mozzarella, and fresh basil on a thin crust usually baked in a wood fired oven.

i prefer new york pizza for sure[url='http://pizzainny.com']new york pizza is the best[/url]

Margherita is the colors of Italy; red, white, green, for Queen Margerita. It is fresh tomatoes, fresh mozerella (not pasteurized), and basil. Lombardi's NYC and others.

Neapolitan means from Naples - pizza sauce and pasteurized cheese (so it melts better). Pizza joint pizza.

Chicago style pizza (despite what people ouside Chicago believe) is a thin, cracker crust...not foldable..this is the true Chi-Town pie that's been around decades before deep dish was "invented" and now is marketed ad nauseum as "Chicago Style"

The best examples are found in the neighborhoods (none are found downtown...tourists want the deep/stuffed stuff)

Great places to try the real thing:

Marie's on West Lawrence
Candlelight on North Western
Calo on North Clark St..

That certainly makes sense to me. I go to a place here in Phoenix called Slices, with a Chicago "theme" and what you've just described is exactly what you get there. It is very tasty! In fact, since it's lunch time here, I think I'll head over there for a slice(or two) right now!

quote:

Originally posted by Fred Ferris

The best examples are found in the neighborhoods (none are found downtown...tourists want the deep/stuffed stuff)

I'm amazed at how many people want to claim that their own regional cuisine are for tourists
So far I've heard
Boston- Baked Beans and Brown Bread- For tourists
Twin Cities- Anything Swedish- For tourists
San Franscico- Cioppino, Hangtown Fry and New Joes Special- For Tourists
Denver- Buffalo and Rocky Mountain Oysters- For Tourists.
and of Course- Chicago- Deep Dish Pizza- For tourists.
I'm sorry I don't buy any of it.
I worked for a company for over 10 years whose home office was in suburban Chicago- Northbrook. I knew many locals through work who loved Deep Dish Pizza- they weren't tourists, they were born and bread Chicagoans.

personally--i have had great pizza in both Chiccago and New York----however---i have had better ones in Connecticut and Massachusetts!

quote:

Originally posted by wanderingjew

quote:

Originally posted by Fred Ferris

The best examples are found in the neighborhoods (none are found downtown...tourists want the deep/stuffed stuff)

I'm amazed at how many people want to claim that their own regional cuisine are for tourists
So far I've heard
Boston- Baked Beans and Brown Bread- For tourists
Twin Cities- Anything Swedish- For tourists
San Franscico- Cioppino, Hangtown Fry and New Joes Special- For Tourists
Denver- Buffalo and Rocky Mountain Oysters- For Tourists.
and of Course- Chicago- Deep Dish Pizza- For tourists.
I'm sorry I don't buy any of it.
I worked for a company for over 10 years whose home office was in suburban Chicago- Northbrook. I knew many locals through work who loved Deep Dish Pizza- they weren't tourists, they were born and bread Chicagoans.

Thanks, WJ. Your comments are dead-on.

Chicago-Style deep dish pizza was invented in the 1930's. It is unique to Chicago.

Although thin crust pizza is quite popular here, I don't know that it was necessarily invented here nor is it unique to Chicago.

By the way, the Great Chicago Fire was started for tourists.

Note after the fact: It would seem that saps submitted his post as I was writing mine. Hence the overlap and redundancy in our comments. Glad to see we are of similar minds.

B.

quote:

Originally posted by wanderingjew
I'm amazed at how many people want to claim that their own regional cuisine are for tourists...I'm sorry I don't buy any of it.
I worked for a company for over 10 years whose home office was in suburban Chicago- Northbrook. I knew many locals through work who loved Deep Dish Pizza- they weren't tourists, they were born and bread Chicagoans.

WJ, please understand that when I refer to my beloved Chicago Pizza in the Pan as "tourist food", I am speaking only of certain and specific outlets for same. Pizza in the Pan is a Chicago specialty. However some of our more visible spots (Uno's, Due's, Gino's) have become tourist destinations, lessening their local appeal and, in some cases overall quality.

There are still plenty of neighborhood joints that make an exceptional version of Chicago Style Pizza. They just don't get the same press as the big boys located much closer to the downtown hotels.

As for the argument that the "real" Chicago pizza is a thin cracker crust; well, okay, I guess there has been thin crust pizza in this town a lot longer than the pan style. But so what. That style has been around almost everywhere a lot longer. How is it defined as "Chicago Style"?

On the other hand, "Pizza in the Pan" has been documented as a Chicago invention; created by Ike Sewell, founder and original owner of Uno's Pizzeria. The fact that it started here, and could only be found here for decades is what makes it Chicago Style.

Buddy

Born and bred in the Suburbs...or the actual city? Honestly, there are aren't too many exclusively deep dish places IN the neighborhoods (not counting downtown and a couple of chains) that serve deep dish as their PRIMARY offering (some offer as an aside to the cracker crust).

Again, not trying to raise heckles....just offering some insight for people who are not from Chicago to possibly expand their pizza experice beyhod the typical....if you try the places I mentioned, you will have a better idea of what a more traditional Chicago pizza is like...I don't know how to define it precisely beyond the crust...but you know it when you try it...

Buddy...you daughter recommended a place near Des Plaines that was quite good...but I'll be damned if I can remember what it's called...they serve by the slice...not thin, not thick...but interesting nonetheless

quote:

Originally posted by saps

quote:

Originally posted by wanderingjew

Originally posted by Fred Ferris

By the way, the Great Chicago Fire was started for tourists.

Gee, and I always thought that it was the Sears Tower that was built for tourists!