Help! I'm scared! Re: 220v hookups

Hello everybody! Thank you all for contributing to such a great site.
 
I've spent the last few hours on here and have gotten some great advice and ideas!
 
I'm heading 8 hours away tomorrow evening to buy my 1st concession trailer Monday morning...
 
I feel like I have found a great deal, its a 97 Pace 8x16 with a 36" grill, 40lb deep fryer, 4ft. commercial hood with fire suppression system, fridge, make table, bathroom (which I kind of wish wasn't there... for storage issues, but it'll be nice...). I've agreed to pay $13,300 for it
 
After almost 2 months of research it is the cleanest, best equipped trailer I have found. The last one I drove to look at was 8 x 20 and a 1986 model for $12,000 and I felt like i would fall through the floor...!
 
I feel confident that I have been thorough in my research, even doing a google of every craigslist post, all over ebay, and several classified sites.
 
My worry is this... the Vent-A-Hood requires a 220v hookup and after doing some more research it looks like that may not be the wisest option. Apparently the whole trailer runs off of this one plug. Some posts on here say generators are a no go at many festivals... I made the mistake of assuming a generator would always be there to fall back on.
 
What should I do? Is this 220v requirement a deal breaker? This is my first endeavor and i plan to do smaller festivals locally the first year to get my feet wet.
 
What should I do? Am I making a mistake? Should I buy the trailer and is there a way to rewire it? I can cook nothing without the hood... my first festival that I hope to make is in March and says 110 only! Is this the exception or the rule? I searched the forum for "220v" and could not find the answer!
 
Help me! I have about 14 hours before I leave out, its 9:30 saturday night central time...
 
Thank you so much!

Not clear from your post if the Vent-A-Hood is 220v or your trailer plug is a 220v (50amp) plug.  If its just the plug then adapters are available, though the power may fall short of your requirements.

Large fairs usually have 50a available, but the small ones can be as little as 10amps.  I use a 3000w quiet Honda most of the time and can use it for most events.  I then typically hook up to the provided electrity overnight to run the fridge and lock up my Honda.

Both from what she has told me...

All she knows is that it uses a plug like a dryer and that is all you need to plug in...

I'm really getting worried, but I can't let a little thing like lack of electrical knowledge stop me can I?

She has also told me the only thing that requires 220v is the Vent-A-Hood.

I have no idea what to look for as far as electrical. All she could tell me is that in her permanent location she could run everything - fridge, micro, stereo, steam table, heat lamp, and two crock pots without flipping a breaker.

I'm sitting here nursing a vodka drink and reading every post that came up in a search of "electrical" trying to find some answers. My gf feels neglected...

I wish I knew electricity better. I feel like I'm in over my head, but I need a change and this is one I can afford!

Dom

I can't see it being a big problem, shouldn't be expensive at all for a 110v to 220v step up transformer.   Google that or 110v to 220v inverter.     220v @ 50a is 11,000 watts, I can't believe the hood itself should need much at all though.   I find out how many Amps/Watts the hood needs?

http://www.220converters.com/store/p/40-10000-Watts-Step-Up-Down-Transformer.html  this is retail price on a 10,000 watt $299..   that should be enough for the entire cart.    Personally though, i'd run the cart off 110v, then use just an inverter for the hood itself, find out how many watts/amps it is.  Probably $75-150 at most to adapt just it.

Thank you for being up late! You don't think this is a dealbreaker then? Is it something I can overcome with the help of a licensed electrician?

I googled "110v to 220v inverter" but the results left me clueless! I just don't get "it" with electricity, but I am definitely going to have to learn!

The second post you with the link... what does that thing do? allow you to run 220v equipment off a 110 hookup?

I love this trailer, it seems like a good deal ( someone speak up if you disagree...) but I would hate to think I need a new hood to make it work at most festivals...

Everything was falling into place until I read how much trouble and hassle people have setting up at all these different places!

Thanks so much for helping me everyone!

If everything is the way you like it, I'd buy it, then change out the 220 vent for a 110 one. The less you have to depend on services from the festivals the better. 

I will not offer you any electrical advice, but I will offer some other advice.

You should NEVER agree on any price, until you kick the tires in-person(or find someone to kick them for you) , review ALL of the paperwork...mechanical, electrical, HD, any documentation from previous events, etc. The less that is available, the more you pause, and wait until the documentation can be gathered by the current owner, and if the current owner is not the original owner, dig deeper. It is a moving vehicle? Title search, DMV reports. You need to cool down a little, because if that owner knows you know so little about the business, and the electrical aspects, you may find yourself quickly manipulated into a quick sale, because there are (of course) soooooo many other interested parties, in this truck (or so you will be told).

One more thing, since I am one of the few women in this section. Is your gf going to be involved in your business? If she feels neglected now...oh honey! Wait until you hit the road, for work!

There are a few pros and many cons in being involed in a relationship that carries over into business. Sometimes that other person knows EXACTLY what you are thinking, without you saying a word.  That can be a VERY GOOD THING or a VERY BAD THING! But, the very good things tend to be distracting, and meanwhile, the bacon is burning!! 
 
The financial aspects of business and relationships...are quite stressful. So, do not neglect your gf, when you are not working. But, be careful about too  much mutual involvement in business/pleasure ventures, unless you get married and she is a VERY understanding and patient woman, with a great sense of humor!

Good Luck!

First, the 220 volt power requirement is not a big deal. You can buy 110/220v power generators for backup and supply.

Next, a simple explanation as to what 220 volt circuits are in the US.  If you look at the 220v plug, there will be 3 prongs.  2 prongs are side by side and 1 prong by itself.  The prong by itself is a ground or neutral wire. The 2 prongs side by side are 110 volt circuits each. 110v + 110v = 220v  

Appliances that use 220v power are built with two separate fused 110v circuits. Thus the requirement for a double pole breaker in the electrical main panel.  So look at the electrical panel and count the number of double breakers and there should be one breaker for piece of 220v appliance or 220v circuit.

An above suggestion was to change the 220v hood, most (not all) commercial motors (fan) are dual voltage and can be wired 110v or 220v. Have a electrician check this or replace the motor if not.  BUT! This does not really solve the problem.

The trailer was built for 220v power supply. IE, it needs two separate 110v (50 amp) lines to the electrical main panel.  If the panel is rewired to work from a single 110v supply line, then it would need to be a 110v, 100 amp (assuming 50 amp stated above is correct, 50amp + 50 amp = 100 amp) hook up.  

It is not likely that most events you would be working will have power hook-ups for you.  If any hook-ups are available at all, they most likely will be 110v, 30 amp and a very few possibly 220v service at much more $$$$.

Your solution is to buy and use a 110/220v, 50 amp generator.  Many events will not have hooks-ups so you need the generator anyway.  Use a drop-cord to run the frig and a light or two at night from any available hook-up when not working.

My assessment is that there really is no problem with the trailer, as you need a generator anyway.

dtortor1
…… Thank you for being up late! You don't think this is a dealbreaker then? Is it something I can overcome with the help of a licensed electrician?……..

I would have the electrician check over the trailer if you think it was needed, but I would not spend money on rewiring for all 110v service.  This could cost more than a generator.  Buy a power generator and forget the 110/220 transformers.

If the trailer is what your looking for buy it. The Hood problem can be solved very easy. If it were me I would replace the hood motor with a 120v one.

Buying the generator was gonna be my easy solution but then as I searched the forum I saw many posts about generators not being allowed at this festival or that festival... is that not as much of a problem as I'm thinking? maybe I just stumbled on a few posts of people that had a big problem with it?

On the couple of apps I have looked at so far, I've seen no mention of generators so is it correct to assume if they don't say no its probably ok? I know the right answer is to call, but I'm just trying to know what to look for on the applications.

It sounds like most of you are in agreement that whatever the case, I should be able to overcome it, so that makes me feel better.

CCinNJ - thank you for the advice! Unfortunately for myself, I've been selling cars for the last 4 years and I hate it. One thing I have learned though is how to negotiate somewhat. I agree that I have not went "by the book" on this one but I do assure you (and myself!) that I have looked at A LOT of trailers in every corner or the net. Not just what is for sale, but what has sold in the past couple of months.
 
The way I'm looking at it is that if I'm going to do this (which I need so bad... I can't take another month of dealing with the car business! my passion is food and I've always wanted a restaurant, but this looks like a MUCH more tangible risk considering what money I have saved) is that I need to get my butt in high gear. Most festivals seem to start booking in January and most require a menu plan and trailer info. I think Oct. thru Dec. would be the peak months for people to sell them if they aren't going to use them anymore.
 
As for agreeing on the price, I have watched this trailer be auctioned on ebay, then ran into it again on runwalkjog.com. the price had been reduced from where I had previously decided it was too expensive. I then did a completed auction search on ebay and saw that the last auction did not go through because it did not meet reserve. The high bid was 13,100, and she had now reduced it to 13,500. In my mind, that meant if the ebay bidder contacted her outside of ebay, BAM, they would get together since no ebay fees would be involved and the trailer would be gone.
 
The fact that it has the fire suppression, is clean, and is manufactured by a reputable supplier (Pace) has made me more comfortable in my decision to commit based only on pictures. When I talked to her on the phone, I found out that it is financed. She claims to have paid $18,000 for it in January, which seems about in line with prices for this kind of setup. Her bank told her that she should expect much less in this economy, which leads me to believe she owes around $13,300 on it, hence its her "bottom dollar". I may be completely wrong, but she did claim people were coming to look at it this weekend, and I could not make it til Sunday. I offered a $300 deposit to hold until I came to look at it. I like it that much it was worth the $300 to have the option to buy it if it checks out. believe me, the actual transaction will take place AFTER i confirm what I am getting. Fortunately, she doesn't know I know so little about electrical. All she knows is it did what she needed. She had it set up in a permanent location, has a 9 year old, and cannot travel with it. She claims she would if she could, the previous owner did.
 
I plan to run a check of the VIN once I get there and inspect it to the best of my knowledge. I'm VERY cautious about this endeavor and don't want to Jump into anything, but as i've said, my gut tells me this is right and sometimes you just have to go with it. I feel like if nothing else, i can get $12,500 on ebay and only be out $800, gas, and two days!
 
As for the gf... I was kind of joking! She was on the couch but she fully supports me and understands that there is time that must be committed to this, especially last night as I have such an important decision to make! We have been together 2 and a half years, and if I can test this out this summer and it looks like it will work, we will take it on together, we do make a great team. As for this year, I have a good friend that is willing to go at it with me. If me and her can't make it as I pursue a dream, then she wasn't right to begin with. If we can (which i sincerely believe!), we will only be stronger... at least that is how I'm looking at it!
 
Again everyone, if you are still reading... thank you so much for the advice and tips! If you have anymore, I still have about 7 hours till I head out...! Does anyone else think I handled it wrong? Do I at least have a clue what I'm doing? All constructive and non constructive criticism is desired!

Well on the generator subject. There are very few events I do that allow them. But the ones that don't allow them usually have plenty of power. The ones I do that have very limited power lets us use them. So I really think you will be fine. Try to find a good deal on a honda generator and you'll never have to worry.  

Hey, let us know how things went with the trailer.  We bought our 8x16'  trailer last December and I know what you mean about car sales.  After being involved with dealers, car sales, new & used for over 30 years I can tell you "there is no business better to get away from in this economy".  In addition, it isn't going to get any better for at least a year or two, maybe more.

After our first year of running a 'weenie wagon' I can promise you 2 things.  First, you won't even make minimum wage the first year.  Second, the experience you will get during that first year will be priceless. 

Godd luck.  There are a lot of people on here always willing to help.  Don't be afraid to ask.

Mike S.

 
Mike, thanks for the kind words!

I went to Oklahoma, the trailer was EXACTLY as promised and I took the plunge! I feel like I found the right trailer for my first endeavor at a price I could afford!

I'm gonna post my story on here, I just haven't gotten around to it yet.

Got back Monday at 11 p.m., and by Wednesday I was no longer a car salesman.

What a great (AND scary) way to start the new year!

I am currently refining my menu and am looking forward to getting my trailer set up and cooking in it for the first time! Also working on insurance issues and making a schedule. I put the cart before the horse in my opinion, but at this time of year I felt I needed to get the trailer settled.. the menu and things can be adjusted, but I'm nothing without facilities....

I spent 3 yrs. and 10 months as a car salesman, I learned A LOT about people. I made a good living for 3 of the years, but as you say, there is no better business to get away from... And I agree that it isn't going to get better anytime soon!

Do you know what your menu will be. If you can post some pictures of your trailer, I would love to see it

Not exactly porkchop but i have pages of ideas! i figure it will vary some... do the standard fair stuff for festivals without many other vendors, but have other ideas for when I need more unique flavor..

Corn Dogs, Sausages, Dogs, Funnel Cakes... I'll talk about the more extreme ideas soon!

I plan to start with the small events this year, I need to get my feet wet... I feel a little silly going into something without more info, but I feel this is the kind of business where alot of it is learning as you go!

I have a marketing degree, and an advertising minor that has so far been wasted at sales jobs... hopefully I can put it to use now! I believe with a little business sense (very little mind you!) like I have, combined with a love for people, a love for food, and a desire for a little freedom in my life, oh, and a dash of creativity... I can make this work. If I fail, what have I lost? A job selling cars? At least I can sell the trailer, right??

Dom

Here is a link to the classified ad for my trailer, I also just made a new post "its official... I'm in the business!"

http://www.runwalkjog.com/concession/97_oklahoma_pace/oklahoma_exp021409.htm

Very smart Be flexible with your menu. You'll do great

What do you think of the rig?

Man I'm jealous your gonna love having the bathroom in the trailer. Save you some much needed steps on those long days

That is one nice stepup. What is  at bottom that covers the wheels made of. I like the clean look  

You don't know how good it feels to hear someone that actually does this tell me they like it!
 
Of course my family and girlfriend do... they have to right? I looked at TONS and this one just hit me as the one! I like the idea of having the bathroom but fear some over zealous health inspector in a far away county... do you think I need to worry? the way my put it is at least I'm not going into a dirty porta potty, then cooking peoples food! Your whole body is contaminated after you do that! That is what I plan to say if I ever meet this inspector...
 
 
I do like the look too, but not necessarily the color of the boards. Its just plywood she cut and painted grey. It was included and is sitting in the back of my truck. If I ever go semi-permanant I'll use it but figure a skirt will be my best bet for versatility and rough terrain! And when I do use it, i'll paint it either black or green i think.

Do you think a green skirt will look good? Was hoping to find somthing nice and bright. I love green, the my woman loves yellow, so we'll both be happy!
 
Dom

green would look good for a skirt. I've seen a bathroom in one other trailer and they worked TN and KY and he never mentioned of having a problem.

Neat rig, congratulations. You’re going to have a sharp learning curve but your background will help a lot.
Just beware that you may start out liking people, but end up realizing there are a bunch of num nuts out there that you have to deal with in the food business. The pain in the ass people make the common, polite, every day Joe look like a champ.
You’ll do fine. I hope your girlfriend gets involved in a big way it will make it even more fun for the two of you.  Again congratulations to you both.
Jack

As I've mentioned around, i was in car sales... At least when someones being an ass at this job, they are gone in minutes not hours!

Its amazing what I've seen in people. You can take the nicest person in the world and send him to the car lot and he could be the biggest jerk you've ever seen. Maybe after 20 minutes he'd lighten up and I could sell him a car. Maybe he'd move on because for some reason I was required to talk to him. Maybe I'd spend an hour with him acting nice just so he could be a total jerk when the market said his car was worth less than he thought...

A little OT but if you go to buy a car... be nice! I know that sounds simple, but really, we aren't all jerks. Some really are! Most are just there trying to make living. i'll tell you this, when I sold a car, I often only made what was called a "mini" - the commission is so low they pay you a minimum amount, $75 to $150 depending on how many you sold. If a deal made less than a $1000, I would sometimes help people get that last money just because they were nice to me. i knew how to get them the best deal, what to say they said to make my manager give the car away...

Also beware (and this is one of the things I hated the most) is that it's the nice people that will overpay (if not diligent... no need not to be nice... . They like you, they like the car, and they pay what my boss asks the first time. Of course my house payment relied on it... very conflicting. The funny thing was the people that you felt payed to much, were usually the ones that were the HAPPIEST! They felt good about things and made a point to be nice to you in the future. I think I'm getting sick just thinking about the business again. It is so bad, on both sides!

So yeah, I think though that I can deal with these people that just want to complain when my dog is $4 at a festival because 25% goes to the promoter...

I think I will enjoy the many happy people that are like I am at the fair... Excited to eat! Glad to hand over my money for something good! i want us to like each other and for them to come back all weekend! I will take good care of 'em!

As for the gf... thanks for saying that! Its a big concern for me. You see so many negative things (was actually reading old posts on here earlier...) about working with a spouse. Its good to hear positive. She and I really gel in the kitchen when I cook. She is great. My perfect compliment. My plan for now is for her to keep working the "day job" and for me to try this out. We may at some point move to Alabama where she would be my partner. I wish she was now, but I think it best if I work it with an employee for now because I don't want to bring her down if I fail! She's gonna help when she can though!

Dom

Dom,
“So yeah, I think though that I can deal with these people that just want to complain when my dog is $4 at a festival because 25% goes to the promoter... “
So here’s what you do, Post a very well made sign that says :
(the name of your company) Donates 25 percent of
Every dollar you spend with us too next year’s event.
We Love (the name of the event or town). And thank
You for supporting the (event name) and (your company name)
Word it however you like but the point is your customer will understand your paying a high percentage for being there and it goes to the event/promoters. You end up being the good guy.

“I want us to like each other and for them to come back all weekend! I will take good care of 'em! “
There will be days that it will be hard to keep that thought in mind. But just remember you don’t want to go back to selling cars after you made the great escape.

“As for the gf... thanks for saying that! Its a big concern for me. You see so many negative things (was actually reading old posts on here earlier...) about working with a spouse. It’s good to hear positive. She and I really gel in the kitchen when I cook. She is great. My perfect compliment. “
 
Well the more she is involved the more she will understand how hard you work and why the long hours. Hopefully you can hit a good lick in the beginning and she will realize there is very good money to be made. And if she was used to the strange hours of your selling cars, I’d think that will help.
Good luck.
PS I don’t like munchies for a name. Use a name that reflects your business in a good light and tells everyone exactly what you sell, and how good your product is. Or what sets you apart from the other 50 vendors that are next to you.

I have read through many of the threads concerning electrical hookups.  Getting final answers aren't easy as this isn't 1,2,3.  I am planning on having a standard generator 220 plug in on the outside of my trailer and then split that to 110 at the circuit box.  Would I be better off having it go into the trailer as 110?
 
If I stay with the 220 input I have a couple of questions.  I can buy a converter so that 110 plugs into the converter which keeps my internal wiring the same when I am not using the generator, correct?  Do the 110 plugs provided at events have a male end on them?  If not then how do you connect to the female plug so that you have a male plug going into the converter?
 
Thanks, great forum and this should be worth $20 

you will use a line at events called a shore power cord for plugging into "house juice" it will have a male plug to plug into the "pole" and a female plug that will connect to your service entrance.... the reason being if there is ever a break in the line (unplugged) there wont be bare metal spades present to pass current
 
ie: every break in the system from the ultimate source will be female towards the supply, male towards the load...
 
are you going to be running any 220 appliances ? i would run it 220 to the box and split it there, that way if you have a 220 appliance, or get one in the future you are already set to come from the box to the outlet with what you need
 
less wiring headaches that way also, might not sound like it, but one line into the box is best, and im sure code somewhere....the general way of doing it is to split in the box....

swohio


I have read through many of the threads concerning electrical hookups.  Getting final answers aren't easy as this isn't 1,2,3.  I am planning on having a standard generator 220 plug in on the outside of my trailer and then split that to 110 at the circuit box.  Would I be better off having it go into the trailer as 110?

If I stay with the 220 input I have a couple of questions.  I can buy a converter so that 110 plugs into the converter which keeps my internal wiring the same when I am not using the generator, correct?  Do the 110 plugs provided at events have a male end on them?  If not then how do you connect to the female plug so that you have a male plug going into the converter?

Thanks, great forum and this should be worth $20 

Apparently, you don't understand what 220 volt service is.   The line voltage on each hot leg is 110/120 volts.     Use a volt meter to prove it to your self.    The line volt from each hot leg to the ground/neutral is 110/120 volts;   but from hot leg to hot leg is 220/240 volts.   ... If for some reason a hot leg to ground does read 220 volt; or hot leg to hot leg reads 0 volts then the service panel is not wire properly.
 
This page will show different connections and service options.   Also. it show how to make your addapter pig tails for the shore power cord.
http://www.bobhatch.com/electricStuff/30to50amp.htm

F.W.I.W. I have done a few events and I have never been offerd a cord that will plug right into my service line they always give me a plain ole 30 amp( if i'm "REAL" lucky) outlet where I have to run my ext. cord to a adapter cord that adapts my a 50 amp, to a 30 amp, to hook the ext cord into.which powers my trailer(well some of it anyway's.)all the adapters can be purchaced at home depot or r/v. stores. but thats the events i have done maybe I need to update my events LOL;>}