Hey everyone, I'm here for my dad.

Hi! I'm Amanda and I found this forum and been browsing the posts and it looks like there are some nice and knowledgeable people here :)

Both my mom and dad own a coffee shop here in the Pocono's, Pa. We opened back in August of 2002, and after about 2-3 years our business doubled. However, it is now at a stand still, and I think they are about to put it on the market :( We are trying to find ways to increase our business, but sadly there has been a recent development on our street (we are located on a main road) and there is now a Panera Bread and a Starbucks about 4 miles from us.

A little about "Dale's Cafe": We serve lunch and dinner, and are open from 11-8 daily. Homemade soups, chili, salads, panini's, wraps, and egg sandwiches basically consist of our menu, plus some italian dishes for our dinners. My dad always makes sure to have the highest quality foods offered at the lowest possible prices, and I'd say our coffee is amazing. My dad is ALWAYS there, he practically lives there, and he and my mom have put so much energy into the place, making it look spectacular. We also display local artwork which can be purchased and is rotated monthly, which many people like to come and look at.

I feel really bad that they need to sell it, just because of corporate America had to move in down the road. Has anyone else had to deal with this sort of thing?

quote:

Originally posted by lalaland
I feel really bad that they need to sell it, just because of corporate America had to move in down the road. Has anyone else had to deal with this sort of thing?

Lalaland,
Yes, practically everywhere.Fortunately, there are maladroits like me who simply prefer real, mom-and-pop places, and who love to spread the word about the good ones we find out there.
Tell them to don't give up yet. Word of mouth is the best advertising there is. Y'all may have to adapt to sustain, but Darwin said we had to adapt or die, and he was a lot wiser than I'll ever live to be.
Filledosophically, Ort. Carlton in Chain-Ridden, But Still Mom-And-Popful Athens, Georgia.
P. S. How far are you from Waymart? I have a friend from there.

quote:

Originally posted by Ort. Carlton.

quote:

Originally posted by lalaland
I feel really bad that they need to sell it, just because of corporate America had to move in down the road. Has anyone else had to deal with this sort of thing?

Lalaland,
Yes, practically everywhere.Fortunately, there are maladroits like me who simply prefer real, mom-and-pop places, and who love to spread the word about the good ones we find out there.
Tell them to don't give up yet. Word of mouth is the best advertising there is. Y'all may have to adapt to sustain, but Darwin said we had to adapt or die, and he was a lot wiser than I'll ever live to be.
Filledosophically, Ort. Carlton in Chain-Ridden, But Still Mom-And-Popful Athens, Georgia.
P. S. How far are you from Waymart? I have a friend from there.

Ort. Carlton,

I actually have never heard of Waymart. I'm pretty close to the New Jersey border (about 10 minutes away)

Thanks for the encouragement. It's sad seeing local businesses being overtaken. I wish they would just leave our town alone!

I know the restaurant at the hotel I manage makes the majority of it's money from breakfast.

Amanda, I'm not a restaurant pro, but I'm a customer who'll drive past as many Panera Bread and Starbucks locations as needed to get to a locally owned shop such as yours.

I've been to both Panera and Starbucks and consider their product offerings mediocre at best. I don't understand what they could possibly have that generates customers.

I sincerely wish you much success, because it's shops like yours that offer variety and excitement when it comes to dining out.

I was thinking the same as CSD, change your hours and go for the breakfast crowd. Panera and Starbucks might catch those who just want bagels or pasteries but I bet there are many out there looking for a good breakfast. Make sure your hash browns are home made, a good home made corned beef hash too, and maybe a egg sandwich or things that can be grabbed and eaten on the run. The mom and pop places around me that are open from 6-2 or so do a great business and have lines out the door on the weekend.

Welcome to America...It might be easily dismissed to say "you can still do it" but you can. You just have to make sure you have a better product(s) than your chain competitors and treat your customers on a more personal basis. There are still plenty of people who enjoy independent restaurants and the creative things they serve.

===Both my mom and dad own a coffee shop here in the Pocono's, Pa... ... We are trying to find ways to increase our business, but sadly there has been a recent development on our street (we are located on a main road) and there is now a Panera Bread and a Starbucks about 4 miles from us... ...A little about "Dale's Cafe": We serve lunch and dinner, and are open from 11-8 daily.===

Both places are meant as spots where you can sit around and do nothing. No restaurant can work that way. You want a place where you can say "Hurry up and eat."
I have a disconnect when you say that you are a coffee shop, but you open @11:00 AM. No coffee shop opens at 11 AM. Closing at 8:00 PM? Seems kinda early. Does the town close up around that time? What time does it wake up? Are there places to go for a -great- breakfast?

====..... Homemade soups, chili, salads, panini's, wraps, and egg sandwiches basically consist of our menu, plus some italian dishes for our dinners. ===

Now here is where I may sound kind of cold, your menu is boring. Paninis and wraps are yesterday's news. How many egg sandwiches do you sell after 11:00?
I like this review for the All-Star Sandwich Bar. They proudly proclaim that they are 'wrap free' since they opened. Also, look at those sandwiches, your competition isn't making food like that.... and I think that may be true for you.
You need to create a menu that is so unique that you become a destination for a one-of-a-kind sandwich or lunch in general.

http://www.roadfood.com/Reviews/Writeup.aspx?ReviewID=4223&RefID=4282

As for Italian dinners, I think that it may also be a disconnect for your customers, as your lunch menu doesn't sound Italian. Most Italian restaurants do not end with the name 'Cafe'. Do you sell beer and wine? What is the competition for Italian food?

===My dad always makes sure to have the highest quality foods offered at the lowest possible prices, and I'd say our coffee is amazing.===

You need to promote that quality, make people aware of that fact. Create a new and exciting menu that stays within the concept of a small cafe. Have a sign in the window that proclaims your coffee is 'Better than the Other Guys'. That is a start.

It's great that you keep prices low, but maybe people don't think that you are usng quality at the price. Don't be shy to consider raising prices a little to justify your quality. People will pay for it, especially if there are generous portions of flavorful food that is unique to your place.

=== My dad is ALWAYS there, he practically lives there,====

This may be a small problem too. It is tough when you are so dedicated to working that you don't take time off to step back. They need to look at the whole picture at the place, but more important, at other places. What are the other guys doing? I see this happen frequently.
You need to get him to this site, have him look up Diners or Cafes. There may be something that could interest or inspire him and see what makes other places succesful. Right now, I bet he is getting tired.

===... he and my mom have put so much energy into the place, making it look spectacular. We also display local artwork which can be purchased and is rotated monthly, which many people like to come and look at.===

This is where they may have a great strong point. If the place looks spectacular, that is a big plus. Having local art on display is something that demonstrates you're part of the community, and support it. You want them to support you too.
Do you contact the local paper with info on the changing art exhibits?
You say that people come in to look at the art. Do they stay to eat, or leave after looking at the menu? You need to make them stay. Either way, in the back of my head I see a week-end art show outside of your place.

There are other responses with the suggestion of doing breakfast. I am of that camp too, but I like doing breakfast and lunch. You can close at 3:00PM and still see the blue sky outside. When was the last time they saw the sun set?

One other thing. I have been cooking for over 30 years and I like two TV shows that keep me motivated and introspective too. These shows keep me fresh.

I like Ramsey's Kitchen Nightmares. Either on BBC America of Fox, both versions are interesting.
That show is where he comes to places that are having problems such as yours and gets them back to and sometimes exceding prior levels of business.

The other show is 'Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives' on the Food Channel. I love the food and places that he goes to in each episode. It is similar to what this site is all about. First and foremost it is the food, but a great atmosphere helps. It may inspire dad to create something unique too.

Good luck, do come back here as we are great at giving free advice. Sometimes it is even good advice with the right answer.....

mark

PS. Right now, business is slow for almost all restaurants in the nation. Don't be discouraged.

Amanda, I don't know what your customer mix is regarding locals versus tourists, but let me add my two cents.

I would send out a personal mailing to all your locals within a 10-15 mile radius of your diner. Use a greeting card or invitation card format instead of the typical commercial-looking mailing. In it, emphasize that you're locally owned and dependent upon the locals to try your outstanding menu items. Suggest that they stop in for a piece of pie or cake and a cup of that coffee you mentioned. When they stop in for that cup of coffee, make sure they see your menu so that they have a reason to come back for a meal.

Also, have a brochure printed and distributed to all the area hotels, motels, and B&B's, especially the locally owned ones. Ask them to place a brochure in each room. Those that are locally owned will probably do this for nothing. In the brochure, emphasize that it's an opportunity for the traveler to sample local fare rather than typical chain offerings that they can get when they get back home.

Oh, and another thing. Let those local artists know that you're depending on them to bring in some customers too.

Good luck!

lalaland, You are located in an extremely high traffic area during the daytime hours.

All the resorts in your area usually include dinner in their rate or are all inclusive. Listen to the experts above who are giving you free advice. Open at 6:00AM and be closed by 3:00PM.

The main source of traffic in the morning is from New York transplants catching the buses for the 2 hour ride to the City. Feed Them.

Everyone,

Thank you so very much for all your advice! I'm going to tell my dad to get on here and read everything. While I am not really a part of the restaurant because I am a full time college student, I live with my parents and see what they are going through everyday to keep it running. We have many local regulars that would be very sad to see us go.

It's nice to hear encouraging words and it's even better to read through all of your ideas. We did try breakfast at one point, and we didn't make much of a profit. However maybe we will try it again and see how it goes.

An above poster asked if most of our business was due to travelers or locals. It's really a mix of both, I'd say the locals being the bigger portion.

Again- thanks everyone and I'm sure you'll see my dad on here very soon!

hi i'm Lee, Amanda's Dad thank you all for the helpful feedback the suggestion for an art show is great i already have an established network of local artists and it will be easy to put together also, i stay open for dinner because i never made much of a profit from breakfast, we get more revenue from the dinner business, and the bulk of our business comes from lunchtime i also like the suggestion to raise menu prices food costs have increased substantially and i haven't taken time to follow up

Hi ya Dad! welcome to RF!

Nice thread.

welcome, dark roast. great thread. thats a smart daughter, you got there. really good of her, to search for solutions for you all.
i am in the early stages of opening a cafe, just south of you. lancaster. we are hoping to get a good grip on the breakfast crwd, but i am going in knowing that it is the least sales generating meal of the day. we will be targeting lunch as our main sales generator. we are configuring our menu, to offer a huge variety, to cast a bigger net, so to speak. another ploy for us is milkshakes. what better way thank that, to add a few bucks to a meal ticket? plus of course, a variety of icecream products. for lunch, we are doing subs(steak subs too, of course), burgers, bbq sandwiches, paninis, salads, gyros, and soups. all this, inside a three hundred square foot hole-in-the-wall. thats the plan, anyway. we shall see.lol
we are sure that our success will come from all angles. one big contributor for us will be local delivery.we are surrounded by 4 other shops, that sell subs, pizza, and tons of other stuff. but, not a single one of them deliver!
in short, the lesson is, find a need, create a method, and market that need. this will give you an edge over the competition.
i hope this helps
good luck
mike

To introduce breakfast when your parents are already stressed out with the other meals is tough. It is usually a knee jerk reaction when things are not going well at one's restaurant. And, it usually does not work. Check averages at breakfast are lower..There are more people trying to put out low price breakfasts and it's just nore stress on the staff, equipment and the owners. They have to have some time to themselves or they will burn themselves out.

If you can get your press release in the paper, that's a great idea. What they really need is an unsolicited review from the local restaurant critic..Very, very hard to get. But, they can try by having some of their customers e-mail the critic. Have some friends write and tell the critic about the place. Understanding, if the critic shows up, it's make or break time. A good review will most likely save the business. A bad one may put them out of business.

We got what I still call the "$250,000 Restaurant Review." It literally saved our restaurant that was going to go under within weeks for no reason other than it was a horrible location and we did not advertise. We just thought having good food would get the word around. It will, but it takes a long, long time that way. We took the bad location and a $150,000 build out from the landlord, who needed an anchor in a new building in a bad area. The moral of that story is you get what you pay for and location is very, very important.

We knew someone from out of town, who knew the local reviewer. She got him to come..No promises. We said that would be fine. All we had was our good food. We had nothing to lose at that point. The guy, The Phantom Gourmet, came with several other friends, unannounced, on a dreary Monday night. They came to the counter and started ordering everything on the menu!

My wife recognized him immediately; she'd seen his show on public television (Pittsburgh). We immediately knew what was about to happen. Ity was do or die! It's an amazing sotry that I won't bore you all with. We got a 4 star review, it went on televison and it saved the business. Business literally tripled in a week and kept that way until we sold the place. That review enabled us to get an all cash sale (real hard to do folks) when we decided we wanted to something else.

Your parents need a little luck. Try the restaurant critic route. You have nothing to lose. You are a good daughter to care. It is a very, very tough business.

I agree with Baah Ben about breakfast. Our restaurant has been open for 6 years and breakfast (except for Saturday) has never come close to expectations. 1) Too many people want grab & go at the chains or gas stations, 2)retirees usually eat light at breakfast (1 egg, toast, & coffee doesn't add much to your bottom line), 3)breakfast customers are very loyal to the restaurant they currently go to (it's easier to get people to try you for lunch or dinner.

Baah Ben is also right about finding a new way to get people to know you even exist. I live in a town of 5000 and I still have new local customers come in who say they didn't know we are here. I have advertised heavily on radio, in newspapers, & monthly coupon flyers and nothing has worked.

We finally found a unique way of advertising. Our local cable company has a local underutilized access channel. My mother proposed a cooking show on that channel. For a nominal fee, the restaurant sponsors the show, my mother does dishes from the restaurant, and we give out free recipes from the show at the restaurant. All of sudden we're KNOWN.

Yes, Breakfast turned out to be, for most people, just coffee and a muffin or egg sandwich, but paying for a cook and waitress was making us lose money during that time in the morning.

I like the idea of a food critic. How do I find a critic in our area? Unfortunately our local newspaper stinks and is not very reputable :(

I also really like the idea of having an art show event. We could have the local artists there and I'm sure they'd appreciate the publicity.

quote:

Originally posted by Baah Ben
You are a good daughter to care.

Lalaland,
I second that immensely!
Your attitude will keep them going and help them to succeed. Hang in there.
Not Poking My Nose, Ort. Carlton in Appalachian Foothills Athens, Georgia.

Lalaland,
Hey, I thought of something else. Your folks can poll their customers informally and see if anyone has any ideas. They can be honest with these regulars and semi-regulars and say that going up against the chains is a drag and they want some input. You don't have to take even a single suggestion, of course, but it costs you nothing and you may get a million dollars' worth of decent ideas that have thusfar eluded you.
As my friend Rick from Connecticut says, "Hang in there."
Hanging Like A Three-Toed Sloth, Ort. Carlton in Amazing Athens, Georgia.
P. S. I guess you've figured out my by now that most of my posts are waist-deep in terrible punnery, even though my messages are often totally serious... like here. I am also a dreafdul typist.

quote:

Originally posted by darkroast

Darkroast,
Welcome!! You oughta be really proud of a daughter who takes the kind of initiative that she took. Evidently her heart is really in what you're doing. I think I speak for a lot of folks here when I say give her a good hug for all of us at Roadfood.
What I wish also is that I could send you some of our locally-available dark-roast coffee. I can even purchase Tampa coffee here; you almost have to chew it! Now THAT'S a righteous cup of coffee! (Or as my dad used to joke, "If the spoon falls over in the cup, it's too weak.")
Decaffeinatedly, Ort. Carlton in Ever-Amazing Athens, Georgia (where we STILL can't buy Yuengling Beer!).

quote:

Originally posted by lalaland

quote:

Originally posted by Ort. Carlton.

quote:

Originally posted by lalaland

Ort. Carlton,
I actually have never heard of Waymart.

Lalaland,
I forgot to tell you... Waymart is on U. S. 6 between Carbondale and Honesdale. One good blink and -- BINGO! -- you've missed it!
Geo-Graphically, Ort. Carlton in 30601-Land.

quote:

Originally posted by Ort. Carlton.

quote:

Originally posted by darkroast

Darkroast,
Welcome!! You oughta be really proud of a daughter who takes the kind of initiative that she took. Evidently her heart is really in what you're doing. I think I speak for a lot of folks here when I say give her a good hug for all of us at Roadfood.
What I wish also is that I could send you some of our locally-available dark-roast coffee. I can even purchase Tampa coffee here; you almost have to chew it! Now THAT'S a righteous cup of coffee! (Or as my dad used to joke, "If the spoon falls over in the cup, it's too weak.")
Decaffeinatedly, Ort. Carlton in Ever-Amazing Athens, Georgia (where we STILL can't buy Yuengling Beer!).

Thanks everyone, for the great compliments. I really do want to see my parents succeed with this!

Ort. Carlton, I bet we'd love your dark roast, our family sure does like very strong coffee

The idea of polling the costumers is good, I'm going to mention that to my dad.

Ort. Carlton, I have family in Athens Georgia!

Lee and Amanda, I wish you well. As a long time road warrior, something I like in a place like yours is free wireless internet access. I generally end up eating alone, and if I can check E-mail or just surf to kill a little time it makes it more enjoyable for me. I never go into Panera Bread that I don't see several people with open laptops, and it sounds like they are some of your main competition.

quote:

Originally posted by lalaland

quote:

Originally posted by Ort. Carlton.

quote:

Originally posted by darkroast

Ort. Carlton, I have family in Athens Georgia!

Lalaland,
I've lived here off-and-on (mostly on) all of my life. Tell me who it is; I might just know them!
Feel free to shoot me an e-mail if you want. The world is small indeed, isn't it!
Amazedly, Ort. Carlton in Liveable Athens, Georgia.

quote:

Originally posted by Michigander

Lee and Amanda, I wish you well. As a long time road warrior, something I like in a place like yours is free wireless internet access. I generally end up eating alone, and if I can check E-mail or just surf to kill a little time it makes it more enjoyable for me. I never go into Panera Bread that I don't see several people with open laptops, and it sounds like they are some of your main competition.

It depends on whether you want to look busy, or actually be busy. The problem with an internet cafe is that you end up with a bunch of people who sit for a long time and don't buy anything, or expect you to keep filling their coffee cup. If you're limited on space, the last thing you need is for some bozo(s) to tie up a table when other people would like to sit down and buy something.

quote:

Originally posted by jman

quote:

Originally posted by Michigander

Lee and Amanda, I wish you well. As a long time road warrior, something I like in a place like yours is free wireless internet access. I generally end up eating alone, and if I can check E-mail or just surf to kill a little time it makes it more enjoyable for me. I never go into Panera Bread that I don't see several people with open laptops, and it sounds like they are some of your main competition.

It depends on whether you want to look busy, or actually be busy. The problem with an internet cafe is that you end up with a bunch of people who sit for a long time and don't buy anything, or expect you to keep filling their coffee cup. If you're limited on space, the last thing you need is for some bozo(s) to tie up a table when other people would like to sit down and buy something.

This is true. We do have a wireless available in our place, and some people do use it. But during the busy lunch time, it would hinder the turnover having people sitting for 2-3 hours.