Hired Help for a hot dog stand . .worth it?

The main obstacle I see in my dream to open a hot dog stand is the fact that I cannot afford to run it myself.

Our current business is a full time job for both myself and my wife, and quite frankly for either one of us to quit or cut back in order to operate a hot dog stand would mean a substantial cut in income. That just wouldn't make any sense.

So my only choice would seem to be to hire someone to run the hot dog business. But who? Where do you find a competent and trustworthy individual willing to work at a wage you can afford to pay at a hot dog stand?

I've thought of maybe a partnership with someone who could run it, but I've had partnerships in the and they always seems to go sour after awhile.

So why bother with a hot dog stand at all? I dunno. Ego, maybe? It's just always been a dream of mine (along with owning a restaurant/bar, a coffee shop, a live-music club, an independent record label, a bed & breakfast, and a number of other things). I guess I'm just an entrepreneurial type who loves the process and challenge of the start up. I've started a number of varied business's in the past - an entertainment paper, a classified auto magazine, an advertising agency, a cartoon map company, an airbrush t-shirt business - all with varying degrees of success. But as soon as it's off and running and has proven somewhat successful, I tend to get bored and want to move on to a new challenge.

However, my current business is too lucrative to leave, so I can only realistically look at this hot-dog stand as a hobby that can possibly turn a profit.

Humm. Zero responses out of 61 reads. Did I say something wrong?

Maybe my question was too buried in my explaination of why I needed to pose the question in the first place. If that's the case I apologize for the oversight.

But the question was basically: How/where do you find honest, reliable help that you can afford to pay and still make a hot dog stand financially feasable?

I want to open a stand within the next year, but cannot operate it myself because of other business obligations. I could however operate it on occasion and oversee it daily. Just couldn't do it myself full time, or even part time for that matter.

I'm kind of in the same boat. I have a hot dog stand that I work daily...but I want to get another one going as well. Problem is, anyone that I think is competent to do a decent job...already has one. I'm not sure what anyone else thinks, but if you want a hot dog cart, why don't you wait until you can get it going and see what the job entails before you look into hiring someone to do it. On the surface this is a pretty easy job. I've found that it is really time consuming and...a lot of work. If you had someone that you wanted to give a job too I could understand it (the neighbor kid that mowed your yard through high school, or a favorite nephew or something) but to put this much responsibility on someone you don't know, without having the experience yourself to know the ins and outs of this trade...well, that sounds like too much brain damage to me. I know you want to do this thing...can you wait until your time constraints allow you to get into it? Or maybe get a cart and do just some select events that you have time for?
Dude, this is the funnest thing I've done in years. And I'm starting to make some decent cash. So I can dig you wanting to get into it, but...well, you know my opinion by now. Good luck man.

Thanks Jim, for your reply.

My current business is open 44 hours per week. I spend anywhere from 20 to 40+ hour there myself, and have a small staff who operates it when I'm not there. But they all work on commission, so it's a situation where the more work I'm there to handle personally, the more I take home. This situation is not likely to change in the foreseeable future.

My idea is not for a simple hot dog cart, but a permanent(or semi-permanent), theme-based, drive-up hot dog restaurant/stand (explained in more detail in a previous thread) with space for limited outdoor dining. For me, the concept, design and start up is the fun. As fun as it might also be to actually work it (as a stress-relieving change of pace if nothing more), the fact is unless it can earn me a literal $100 per hour, time spent there would be money lost.

I would HAVE to hire someone to run it, or it just won't work.

No No No. You have no idea of the amount of work involved with that. You will most likely lose money for 6 months or more, as do 95% of new restaurants.

Jim, you should hire a guy who has a cart, but doesn't make as much as you do at your cart. Give him a measly 200 bucks a day and make him run his butt off. I could email you his information if you want it. Cheddar sauce rules!

===Starting a business as an absentee owner is an invitation for disaster. ===

It's funny, one job had a owner who would walk off in the morning to go to the store, just before the breakfast rush. When he would come back, the place was all heck and the customers were not happy. Then he would go off again to get bread from the day old store. When he would get back, once again he would get pissy due to how messed up things had become out front.
My point is that as an absentee owner, you still are captain of your ship and responsible for the operation of it. You need to be there even if someone else is steering.

===One of the biggest obstacles in the food service business is finding and keeping good help.===

One of my favorite sayings is "Good -cheap- help is hard to find."

I am sure that mattcrunk has thought and dreamed alot about this idea. As much as he is looking for a way to make this work, he needs to consider all the ways it can fail. I do not want to sound negative, but this may be beneficial. I think the other responses bare this out.

mark

matt, i know where yo are coming from. i have various business ideas
all the time, but i dont get to act on them. your ideal theme, is good, but i dont see how you will go from a cart to a restaurant. unless..... you create a specific color theme, create a brand name, flash it all over town, lease, yes lease, a dozen carts all over town, for a small period of time. through the lease program, you can collect money, and never be there. plus, build your name. then, when the time is right, build your perm. stand

In our state (Massachusetts), CORI is in the news. Basicly, CORI lets a potential employer check on the background of potential employees. If you made a mistake 30 years ago, you will not get hired by most companies......period. Past offenders who have done their time are very upset because they can't get honest work. I have been reading that some of them are very good workers, and that they work cheap because of limited options. I understand that in my state a lot of ex cons are finding minimum wage, food service jobs for small companies.

To bassrocker4u2: You must have misunderstood. I don't currently have a hot dog cart. Never have, nor do I want one. In fact my town has no hot dog carts (probably does not allow them) and no permanent hot dog stands either, save for one poor "hotdog & ice cream shop" that just opened up.

But a strong brand image and identifiable look are exactly my goals. My idea is for a small trailerable, semi-permanent structure about 8' x 12' with an attachable deck large enough for half a dozen small tables. I'll build and own the structure, so I'll only need to lease a small well located lot to sit it on.

As I said before. Marketing and design are my forte, so image will be my main goal, second only to good food.

I don't need to make a living off of this. My current business provides me with that. This venture is mainly for fun. If it turns a profit, great. But even if it loses money and tanks in six months, it'll still have been fun, and another feather in my cap.

finding help that will come to work everyday is hard enough, finding competent help to run a business? somewhere from a thousand times harder to impossible!

Matt,

Why don't you go talk to the guy that just opened the "hot dog & ice cream place"? Maybe he could use an investor. Tell him you want control of the hot dog part and let him run w/ the ice cream. It may be a good way to get into the business while he or she runs the place.

The "Hotdog & Ice Cream Shop" (that's litterally it's name. Inventive, huh?)I spoke of is a joke of an operation. I'll be surprised if it lasts the summer. Elderly couple. No head for business. No thought to image and a multitude of bad business choices from the get go. Most importantly though, it's simply not at all what I want. If I just wanted to invest in something, I can think of a lot of better places to put my money than any sort of retail food business.

See, I don't want JUST a hotdog stand. I want MY hotdog stand - the one that's in my head. My dream stand. I won't settle for less.

I have the start-up capitol. I have the dream. I have the design and planning skills. By the time I open the doors I'll have the knowledge I need to make it work. That's the whole reason I'm here on this forum - to help me gain the knowledge I need and fill in the gaps.

The best hot dog stand I have ever seen was in the most competitive environment, imaginable. A block long strip alongside the NYS Capitol building. The stands were wheel to wheel, each hawking different goods.

By far the most successful stand was the one that hired well endowed SUNY gals in skimpy outfits.
The food was crap, but the lines were long, every single day.

Of course no self respecting Roadfood Professional would do this sort of thing, but I think there is a chain that does do it,something to do with owls, I believe. Since the chain is successful, perhaps you could try your own owl calls to attract customers. Call me a nature lover, but I think it would work.

My wife would divorce me if I only hired well-endowed young ladies to work my stand.

Hello All,
Mattcrunk, there are many competent people out there, wanting to be a part
of a new venture, that have no money to start their own ventures.
Offer a share of the business to someone who is hungry to make something of
themselves as well as make a successful business. Some of us have a work
ethic and desires for success, but lack the knowledge or money to make it happen.
Be a mentor to someone and you may fulfill your dream and someone elses.
Take Care,
Fieldthistle

Has anyone here read the E Myth? It discusses this very thing. A business owner can be three positions:

Entrepeneur
Manager
Technician

The Manager is what your strive to be as the business grows. Otherwise the 50+ hour weeks will burn you out and your business will fail.

If you have to be there everyday the business will fail. If cant find a "technican" to operate your business then you will fail. Folks this is the reason 95 percent to new business fail in the first 3-5 years due to owner burnout.

Ronnie

I am a retired Marine and I recommend that anyone looking for help with their cart or stand consider former or retired military folks. If you can find younger guys right out of the service who are going to school, etc., they are usually looking for work that is flexible schedule wise that allows them to attend classes. On the other hand, if you find some older retired military guys, they often are looking for something that puts some money in their pocket in addition to their pension.

While the military, like all organizations, has its 10% of misfits, in general, when hiring former military guys you will get folks who show up on time, take direction well, understand how to solve problems while you are away and they will work hard for fair wages.

Any military base has an office that specializes in helping guys find jobs as they leave the service. If your town has a reserve center you can stop in there and let folks know you need some help.

Just thought I'd chime in with this, as there is no doubt that finding reliable staff is one of the critical ingredients of expanding a business or running one when the owner is absent.

Semper Fi, Mike

Try looking at your local business college. I'm a restaurant consultant and have owned 2 in the past. If you really want it to be successful, open the books and teach a student how to run the business. Pay an hourly wage plus commission on NET profit, inventory loss reduction and sales increases. I have taken young students in the past and turned them into great restaurant managers. Remember though, there are no GOOD restaraunt managers only bad and great. You'll know quickly if someone has the gumption to do the job. Keep tight controls on inventory and money and you can make it work. Be advised that you need to spend a lot of time in the front end to make sure the work is being done to your standards. Good luck.

If I couldn't be there I personally would not do it to start. If you could run one and then add another cart I believe you could make that work. We ran one trailer for 3 years before I felt confident enough to add another one, I still have my dad oversee the second unit. When you handle cash you can never be to careful

quote:

Originally posted by porkchopexpress

If I couldn't be there I personally would not do it to start. If you could run one and then add another cart I believe you could make that work. We ran one trailer for 3 years before I felt confident enough to add another one, I still have my dad oversee the second unit. When you handle cash you can never be to careful

Man, I don't know how many different ways I can say this . . . I don't have a cart. I don't want a cart. Not one cart. Not two carts. I'm not talking carts here. My plan is for a single stand in a fixed location.

I could be there for start up as much as need be, but once it was up and running I would not want to devote more than a few hours a week to oversee it. If I occasionally had to work it, that's fine. But I'd not want to be there day in and day out, and as I said before I really could not afford to.

It's kinda like cutting my lawn. I don't usually cut my own lawn because it's far cheaper for me to pay someone else to do it, and then spend that time myself making money at what I do. But I'll still occasionaly get out there and cut the grass myself just because I happen to be in the mood.

Same thing with running a hot dog stand. On occasion I'd love nothing better than to work it. But most of the time I'd rather pay someone else to run it.

I own three carts and I work one and have hired 4 other people. Mainly college kids. They have shifts and it works great. Its a little time consuming counting everything exact to make sure there is no theft but its well worth it.
You have to go into this way.
If the location you have breaks even everyday and you dont lose money, than you win.
You will have a location being built and see if it is beneficial until you could maybe make it full time. The only problems will be, being able to be consistent and gaining regulars. I have found my personality helps my buisness.People like to see the same face and get to know you.
Good luck

I could not, and would not ever want to make it a full time gig. That is not my plan nor intention.

First of all, I don't see a single hog hot stand ever matching what I earn from my current business. Secondly, I would not want to peddle hot dogs as a full time job, even if somehow it did earn more.

My current gig affords me both the money and freedom to pursue a number of other interests (such as a hot dog stand). I would not want to be absolutely chained to anything 40 hours per week. That's when it becomes too much like work.

Not that I mind hard work, but it also has to be fun.

quote:

Originally posted by mattcrunk

quote:

Originally posted by porkchopexpress

If I couldn't be there I personally would not do it to start. If you could run one and then add another cart I believe you could make that work. We ran one trailer for 3 years before I felt confident enough to add another one, I still have my dad oversee the second unit. When you handle cash you can never be to careful

Man, I don't know how many different ways I can say this . . . I don't have a cart. I don't want a cart. Not one cart. Not two carts. I'm not talking carts here. My plan is for a single stand in a fixed location.

I could be there for start up as much as need be, but once it was up and running I would not want to devote more than a few hours a week to oversee it. If I occasionally had to work it, that's fine. But I'd not want to be there day in and day out, and as I said before I really could not afford to.

It's kinda like cutting my lawn. I don't usually cut my own lawn because it's far cheaper for me to pay someone else to do it, and then spend that time myself making money at what I do. But I'll still occasionaly get out there and cut the grass myself just because I happen to be in the mood.

Same thing with running a hot dog stand. On occasion I'd love nothing better than to work it. But most of the time I'd rather pay someone else to run it.

A few hours a week!!!! Good Luck with that!!! CSD I see why you quit posting in here. You reply to a post and you get something like this

quote:

A few hours a week!!!! Good Luck with that!!! CSD I see why you quit posting in here. You reply to a post and you get something like this

The difference between CSD and many others here is that he always seems to have something genuinely insightful and helpful to offer, not just a load of negativity disguised as advice.

I didn't come here to be condescendingly told why my plan will not work. I came here seeking specific answers to a few specific questions I have about a new business I plan to enter.

Also, don't assume my naivete. I've been my own boss for more years than I've worked for others, and have started half a dozen successful companies in variety of fields. My first when I was 15 years old. My most recent at age 32. I know business. I just don't know THIS business - yet.

It sounds like you would be better off starting out with a few festivals or events to get the hang of it and see if you even like it. You might hate it.
Its not always about the money either. You might love it and want to do it. Obviously you dont want to take a cut in pay but you might really like it.

quote:

Originally posted by porkchopexpress A few hours a week!!!! Good Luck with that!!! CSD I see why you quit posting in here. You reply to a post and you get something like this

My 2 cents worth,
So many hungry, would be hard working people, come here looking for advice, inspiration, and someone to share their personal experiences, but recently we have acquired some posters that just don’t like what people are willing to share. Kind of sad because I get a kick out of sharing my personal experience, screw-ups, past experiances and views on my business operation. By the way I’m back up and running and at gangbuster speed. Setting new records every day. I’ll post more Sunday my only day off.

But in the mean time my thought is: Mattcrunk buy a running business and then you can just dabble in it from time to time until you get bored and then go on to your other money making efforts. Of course you’ll make whom ever you hire crazy, and most likely go through a dozen or more managers until you come to realize that most of the people in the concession business are in it because they love it. Their heart is in it, for God’s sake it’s the American dream. They are 100% most of the time and when things go wrong they are still 99.9 %. It’s the hardest way in the world to make a fast buck. It’s also the easiest way in the world to lose 30 or 40 grand.

Your catching heat because you’re playing a game, and when you get bored you move on to a new game. Most people aren’t as fortunate in their life to just make a lot of money that easily. You are, good for you.

But you don’t love vending. So expect those that love vending/ the food business to understand your attitude. And expect them to answer exactly as they have, as if you think just like they do, and love vending. It’s hard for them to understand someone like you.

Jack@DrofBBQ.com
www.DrofBBQ.com

Hey Mike,
did u'r son ever get a cart and do the doggie business after u came to visit me? gene

Jack is absolutely correct. Biker Jim, Jack Chicago and all tghe others who make a success of the food concession business, LOVE their work and they work their BUNS of to be successful.
It is NOT a business that u decide to get into because u want a hot dog cart b usiness..U have to be a workahaulic and be very carefully, smart to be successful..Hiring people is the fastest way to FAILURE!!
We see hundreds of like folks show up here, looking for answers..There is no quick solution!!GO DO IT AND PAY U'R DUES!! OR GO AWAY!!

The main obstacle I see in my dream to open a hot dog stand is the fact that I cannot afford to run it myself.

To bassrocker4u2: You must have misunderstood. I don't currently have a hot dog cart. Never have, nor do I want one.

I have to admit, your post is a bit schizophrenic. I suppose I am tired after working til about now (great job, I work for a major cell company in data tech support).

quote:

Originally posted by Ev1L

The main obstacle I see in my dream to open a hot dog stand is the fact that I cannot afford to run it myself.

To bassrocker4u2: You must have misunderstood. I don't currently have a hot dog cart. Never have, nor do I want one.

I have to admit, your post is a bit schizophrenic.

Schizophrenic? No. I said stand. He said cart. The two are not the same thing, at least not in my book.

When I say "stand" I mean a small inclosed building at a fixed location, which offers walk-up or drive thru service, but no indoor dining. That to me is a stand.

A cart to me suggests something with wheels that is easily moved, but offers no cover for the vendor save for maybe an umbrella. I have no interest in that kind of set up.