How is your local pizza guy doing?

I live in the middle of Massachusetts in a town of about 13,000. We support 5 or 6 independent shops, one Uno, and 2 other chains close to our border. The chains seem to have a harder time staying open than the local guys do. Pizza Hut for example, popular in most of the country, has a hard time in this area.

Somewhat the opposite here in N. Florida: Pizza Hut has been here for
25 years (and 3 different buildings), Hungry Howies moved in when Little
Caesars left about 5 years ago; there was also a Pizza Inn Express located
in the same building with Burger King and it was gone after a year; finally,
the "local" pizza place, Buck's (although it claimed to have locations in
other states), left 3 years ago after a 10-year run.
The closest "independent" pizza place is KC's Pizza and Subs, 16 miles
south of here in Vernon.
I usually go to Pizza Hut for lunch buffet, and Hungry Howies for their
pastrami sandwiches (the only ones in town) and cheesesteak subs...

I am so tired of Pizza. I used to volunteer at a non-profit. Their idea of a "treat" for the volunteers was pizza, from several different chains. I found out later that it was a donation from the Pizza places. The last time they pulled this stunt even our clients would not touch it. Rex in expensive, cold, San Diego.

In Northeast PA, we have SO MANY STYLES of pizza that the chains don't do so well. Domino's caters to late night delivered munchies and Pizza Huts are every 15 or so miles from each other. They do OK, but can't touch our top 40 or 50 pizzerias! Amen!!!

Dearfolk,
We are waist deep in pizza joints in Athens. Many are the usual ho-hum college town fare, but there are others that show real brilliance. I've been told about a place I've not made it to yet... two, in fact... that are on my list of places to try. Since I'm a creature of habit all too frequently, I find myself reading this and beginning to crave an Italian special cold sub from Little Italy, where I'm apt to go after the library closes and I imbibe a couple of pints of Matt's good Cream Ale at Copper Creek Brewing.
If some of y'all happen through town, y'all can yank me out of my rut. I've got places to share but nobody game enough to go gallivanting off with me to try them except my buddy Sandy, and he lives in the wilds of Elbert County, 40 miles afield.
Y'all making me hungry... dagnabbit... and I haven't been long having just ate. Can't lose any weight this way....
Subcravingly, Ort. Carlton in Chillylovely Athens, Georgia.

I try to support my favorite local pizza place, Papa Dom's, as much as possible. The guy is Iatalian from NY and I think his pizza is tops. But he has 4 other chains withing 2 miles of him and I know they consider him a nuisance.

We have about every chain in town that will franchise in this area (Grand Rapids, MI). But we have far more independants then chains here... I'd guess there's atleast 100 shops in the area, if not closer to 150...

We have the following chain outlets here
Uno
Pizza Hut x3
Papa Johns
Hot Stuff

Then we have 60 odd local pizza places, all very well supported, one being in business since 1949.

We too support only the local mom and pops here in Columbus Ohio, our favorite is Eagles Pizza in New Albany. We love the crisper crust but, i just wish Ohio would cut their pizza in triangles instead of squares ....and we always tip the delivery person $5.00

Our little village has at least five independent pizza joints. they all seem to be doing pretty well. Four of the five make a prety good pizza. One is thriving in an abandoned KFC location.
We have no pizza chains at all.

Cheers, John

Unfortunately, it is (for the most part) the opposite here in Cincinnati

The little guys are struggling to stay open, while the local king of pizza (LaRosa's) puts in locations literally right next door to every decent independent pizza joint in town, and slowly drives them out of business.

The ones that tend to be the exception are the places that offer "upscale" pizza, if there truly is such a thing. The places that offer up a standard pie, no matter how good, are always a hair's breadth from shuttering for good.

Unfortunate - Cincinnati is very much a chain dominated market where restaurants are concerned

quote:

Originally posted by Nemis

We too support only the local mom and pops here in Columbus Ohio, our favorite is Eagles Pizza in New Albany. We love the crisper crust but, i just wish Ohio would cut their pizza in triangles instead of squares ....and we always tip the delivery person $5.00

When you order, just ask for a pie cut (triangles) vs. the party cut (squares). I'm pretty sure they'll take care of ya!

Here in Massachusetts, at least in the greater Boston/Worcester area, the independent sub and pizza shops are very well entrenched...you will never see an established independent go out of business.

Although we do have the chains, too, as TMiles indicates. The Pizza Hut closest to me just closed their sit-down restaurant and opened a takeout only pizza and wings store. And Dominos seems to be expanding, but not at the expense of the local independents. I guess the "pie" keeps getting bigger.

TMiles...I just noticed that a Papa John's opened in Leominster...the first that I have seen in MA or in New England for that matter...will be interesting to see how they fare.

The pizza in Tennessee is to live for. Isn't that the opposite of to die for? It's not a pretty picture. But we have our compensations. BTW, how's the hot chicken in Connecticutt?

quote:

Originally posted by Wistah

Here in Massachusetts, at least in the greater Boston/Worcester area, the independent sub and pizza shops are very well entrenched...you will never see an established independent go out of business.

Although we do have the chains, too, as TMiles indicates. The Pizza Hut closest to me just closed their sit-down restaurant and opened a takeout only pizza and wings store. And Dominos seems to be expanding, but not at the expense of the local independents. I guess the "pie" keeps getting bigger.
There was a Papa Johns in Amherst to serve the UMass crowd. It was not there the last time we drove by.

TMiles...I just noticed that a Papa John's opened in Leominster...the first that I have seen in MA or in New England for that matter...will be interesting to see how they fare.

Well I messed that up.......see above entry that I tried to comment on for Wistah. No delete on Roadfood.com.
Anyway there was a Papa Johns in Amherst to serve the UMass crowd. It was gone the last time I drove by.

You should be able to edit your post, as long as you're logged in.

Anyway, we used to be Dominos folks, until we tried Papa Johns. Somehow, their sauce seems sweeter (probably has a secret ingredient of sugar. lol) and the garlic butter dipping sauce is terrific. When our daughter was a toddler, all she wanted was the crusts dipped in the garlic butter. Now she eats everything except the crusts. Just changed overnight.

We do like Pizza Hut, but they don't deliver to us. It's a rare sit-down treat.

There's a New York J&P Pizza in town, but their quality is . . . meh.
http://pages.frederickcounty.com/dining/newyorkjp.htm
http://www.newyorkjandppizza.com/
It's the big Italian joint in our little rural town. The owner supports all the local little league teams, and it's very popular with teenagers. But their sauces are barely mediocre. The pizza isn't even as good as Domino's, we don't think. They advertise that their food is made by "real Italian chefs". Well, it's an Italian family, I guess. lol On the other hand, we often see locals in there picking up pies, so perhaps some find them worth driving to pick up.

There's also a place called Olive Leaf Cafe in our little town. It's got pretty good Italian food, but for pizza, I'll still be calling Papa John's.

I live in NYC, and while of course we have some of the best--if not the best--pizza in America here--Grimaldi's, Totonno's, Patsy's, etc.--I think the quality of the everyday, neighborhood-joint pizza has declined a lot in the last few years. Used to be you could pop in at almost any place, anywhere in Manhattan and get a decent honest slice made in the old-skool manner. Now most places seem to use indifferent sauce, too much gloppy cheese, and a too-thick, doughy crust. Have any other NY'ers noticed this? Maybe this is because the pizza-makers are rarely Italian-American anymore. (Not too imply that only Italian-Americans can make good pizza, but being steeped in the red-sauce culture surely helps.) I'm continually disappointed these days, although every neighborhood has at least one god pizzeria--but it can take a while to find it. OTOH even ho-hum NY pizza is better than the chain stuff, which makes me wonder at the proliferation of Domino's and Pizza Hut. There's even (gasp) a Little Ceasar's on 14th St. now.

I got so tired of the chains, and our one local pizzeria doesn't deliver out this far. Besides, it chaps my arse to pay $25 including tip for one so/so pizza.

I now buy Red Barons Rising Crust Pizza. I get it at the SuperTarget for $3.50 each. I think it is actually better than Pizza Hut and Dominos.

Did anyone else know that Schwann's makes Red Baron?

Tmiles
Be sure you are logged in...then click the last icon on the right (the trash can) on the tool line above your post. A pop-up will ask you to sign the delete box with your password. Do that and the post will delete itself.

quote:

Originally posted by Al-The Mayor-Bowen

Tmiles
Be sure you are logged in...then click the last icon on the right (the trash can) on the tool line above your post. A pop-up will ask you to sign the delete box with your password. Do that and the post will delete itself.

Mr. Mayor,
I tried that, and my brain just deleted itself. NOW what do I do?
Starving For Intelligence, Ort. Carlton in Lovely, Chily Athens.
P. S. Along the same line, there once was a band in Atlanta named The Starving Brain Eaters. That's almost as good as another former local aggregation, The Celestial Voluptuous Banana....

quote:

Originally posted by Ort. Carlton.

quote:

Originally posted by Al-The Mayor-Bowen

Tmiles
Be sure you are logged in...then click the last icon on the right (the trash can) on the tool line above your post. A pop-up will ask you to sign the delete box with your password. Do that and the post will delete itself.

Mr. Mayor,
I tried that, and my brain just deleted itself. NOW what do I do?
Starving For Intelligence, Ort. Carlton in Lovely, Chily Athens.
P. S. Along the same line, there once was a band in Atlanta named The Starving Brain Eaters. That's almost as good as another former local aggregation, The Celestial Voluptuous Banana....

Re-Boot and hope for the best!

Mr. Mayor, where is the trashcan that you speak of?......Tom B.

Found it...Sorry!!...Tom B.

Some of the best pizza I have ever eaten is here in Anchorage at The Moose's Tooth which is also a brew pub and brews excellent beer. The place is ALWAYS jammed and in the summer there's an hour wait for a table.
www.moosestooth.net

quote:

Originally posted by TJ Jackson

Unfortunately, it is (for the most part) the opposite here in Cincinnati

The little guys are struggling to stay open, while the local king of pizza (LaRosa's) puts in locations literally right next door to every decent independent pizza joint in town, and slowly drives them out of business.

The ones that tend to be the exception are the places that offer "upscale" pizza, if there truly is such a thing. The places that offer up a standard pie, no matter how good, are always a hair's breadth from shuttering for good.

Unfortunate - Cincinnati is very much a chain dominated market where restaurants are concerned

The opposite happened in Ft. Thomas. LaRosa's has been gone for twenty+ years while Ft. Thomas Pizza keeps plugging away. Nice people, but the pizza is a little on the inconsistent side. They were once the local Pasquales, but that chain went under back in the 80's and has been Ft. Thomas Pizza ever since. We had an Angelo's that came and went also. (They couldn't seem to completely cook their pizzas. Tower Park Pizza also lasted less than a year. (Ditto on the cooking.) Who wants to eat a raw pizza?

quote:

Originally posted by cwills

I live in NYC, and while of course we have some of the best--if not the best--pizza in America here--Grimaldi's, Totonno's, Patsy's, etc.--I think the quality of the everyday, neighborhood-joint pizza has declined a lot in the last few years. Used to be you could pop in at almost any place, anywhere in Manhattan and get a decent honest slice made in the old-skool manner. Now most places seem to use indifferent sauce, too much gloppy cheese, and a too-thick, doughy crust. Have any other NY'ers noticed this?

I have noticed!...but I think it is just economics rather than who is making the pie, although your theory may also have some truth to it. I think most independent shops are not all that different from chains in that they are just assembly points rather than actual kitchens. I see the same trucks unloading their supplies at many of the local pizza stores in my area. They deliver the dough, sauce, toppings, plates, napkins, boxes...all of it. This means many are using the same dough, the same sauce, and all the same ingredients. I have heard rumors that shops owners in NY have little choice regarding who they buy their supplies from. The good shops are the ones that have a real kitchen, where they are making most of the ingredients themselves...not sure how many are left!

quote:

Originally posted by Tony Bad

quote:

Originally posted by cwills

I live in NYC, and while of course we have some of the best--if not the best--pizza in America here--Grimaldi's, Totonno's, Patsy's, etc.--I think the quality of the everyday, neighborhood-joint pizza has declined a lot in the last few years. Used to be you could pop in at almost any place, anywhere in Manhattan and get a decent honest slice made in the old-skool manner. Now most places seem to use indifferent sauce, too much gloppy cheese, and a too-thick, doughy crust. Have any other NY'ers noticed this?

I have noticed!...but I think it is just economics rather than who is making the pie, although your theory may also have some truth to it. I think most independent shops are not all that different from chains in that they are just assembly points rather than actual kitchens. I see the same trucks unloading their supplies at many of the local pizza stores in my area. They deliver the dough, sauce, toppings, plates, napkins, boxes...all of it. This means many are using the same dough, the same sauce, and all the same ingredients. I have heard rumors that shops owners in NY have little choice regarding who they buy their supplies from. The good shops are the ones that have a real kitchen, where they are making most of the ingredients themselves...not sure how many are left!

I don't know if I've noticed it either, but I tend to not be real experimental on that front, either. I'm just confused that places like Domino's actually survive and, seemingly, thrive in NYC, when there are any number of better options -- often on the same block!

from what ive seen---there is no local pizza here in Oklahoma!--by MY local pizza place--the one back home in Medfield Ma--Casa Bella Pizza---is doing just fine!! Was there recently and am glad to report that the next generation---the 3rd--is now working at the place and still kickin butt!!!But then what can you expect from a place where the founder only took one time to close the place once since 1964---he closed the doors and flew back to Italy to get himself a wife---returned, reopened, and insured the happiness of generations of local pizza fans! Thanks Pat--for many a great meal!

quote:

Originally posted by cwills

I live in NYC, and while of course we have some of the best--if not the best--pizza in America here--Grimaldi's, Totonno's, Patsy's, etc.--I think the quality of the everyday, neighborhood-joint pizza has declined a lot in the last few years. Used to be you could pop in at almost any place, anywhere in Manhattan and get a decent honest slice made in the old-skool manner. Now most places seem to use indifferent sauce, too much gloppy cheese, and a too-thick, doughy crust. Have any other NY'ers noticed this? Maybe this is because the pizza-makers are rarely Italian-American anymore. (Not too imply that only Italian-Americans can make good pizza, but being steeped in the red-sauce culture surely helps.) I'm continually disappointed these days, although every neighborhood has at least one god pizzeria--but it can take a while to find it. OTOH even ho-hum NY pizza is better than the chain stuff, which makes me wonder at the proliferation of Domino's and Pizza Hut. There's even (gasp) a Little Ceasar's on 14th St. now.

Come to the Bronx. Most of the neighborhood shops are operated by Italian- americans and the slices, sicilians, and calzones are still great like back in the day. I go to Nicks on E. Gun Hill Rd in the NE section of the Bronx. Better yet, go to Fordham Rd. Pizza is great.