It's In The Sauce

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captain_keevin
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2006/06/27 16:15:46 (permalink)

It's In The Sauce

Don't know much about algebra...but PIZZA is for everybody or as the song goes...what a wonderful world this would be! Here, in Indiana, I didn't have my first piece of pizza until the late 50s. There was a little pizzaria on 6th Street in Vincennes, Indiana, called Bobe's Pizzaria, where I always heard the owner brought back a recipe from W. W. 2 from Italy or Italians in New York, that they have faithfully used for more than 50 years. There have been other places spring up by other Bobe relatives in nearby towns, like Lawrenceville, Illinois, and Washington, Indiana, with the same basic recipe. It has a thin crust with an unusual sauce, and they don't overwhelm it with the toppings. I grew up eating this pie, and nothing else seems to stack up in our area. It is the same every time, and my favorite is Bobe's Pizza Express in Washington, Indiana, next door to the Black Buggy Amish Restaurant. I always order the large Farouk with everything on it, although again it is not too much... It is just right. I like the thin crust and the sauce. It's seems like everyone else in our area likes all the Bobe's Pizza Restaurants, too. These are true Mom & Pop Roadfood Pizza Joints!
#1

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    captain_keevin
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/06/27 16:31:45 (permalink)
    To be fair, I forgot to mention the Bobe's Pizza on Main Street in Vincennes, Indiana, which also has a large loyal consumer following. They all seem to follow the same basic recipe with some individual differences.
    #2
    UncleVic
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/06/27 23:43:30 (permalink)
    Hey Capt. Welcome to Roadfood! Nice report there.. How bout some pics?
    I'm north of ya in Michigan, and I have to tell ya, 99% of the pizza around here bites. I always enjoy going to Indiana and getting something decent.. I'll be hitting the road south again in August, and cant wait! Pizza and atleast a couple of the tenderloins you folks do so decently...
    #3
    Ev1L
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/06/28 23:36:54 (permalink)
    Its been my long time understanding that the best pizza places use a good not cooked sauce--meaning open up can of quality crushed tomatoes, add spices, let it cook in the over along with the rest of the pizza.

    I live in Connecticut and we have some very good pizza places here that seem to do just that. Watch the cooks as they make them and see what ingredients they put on. Every quality pizza I ever had used a 'raw' sauce that cooked with the pizza.
    #4
    caratzas
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/06/29 03:58:21 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by Ev1L

    Its been my long time understanding that the best pizza places use a good not cooked sauce--meaning open up can of quality crushed tomatoes, add spices, let it cook in the over along with the rest of the pizza.


    So true. My college roommate, an ex-NY pizzaman, insisted the sauce HAS TO cook on the pizza. Of course, the second part of the trick is making sure the oven's hot enough so the sauce does cook a bit.

    After years of wondering why homemade pizza always tasted, well, just WRONG, I followed his advice and became a convert. Simple spices are the best -- some fresh basil, crushed garlic, maybe some red pepper flakes, salt, pepper and oregano, maybe a little olive oil and THAT'S IT -- to let the tomatoes sing without being overpowered by the orchestra. If it isn't spicy enough, you can always add more later. Cheese: Fresh Mootz is great with a simple sauce as you can really taste the subtle creamy flavor -- shreds work too but IMHO fresher is better with the "raw" tomato topping.
    #5
    roadrash
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/07/03 15:43:53 (permalink)
    Seems like most of the pizza places now are *very* miserly with the sauce. To me, the sauce is the keystone of the pie and for some reason pizza parlors have cut back on the sauce and doubled up on the cheese.
    #6
    Ciaoman
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2006/07/05 18:31:02 (permalink)
    I absolutely agree with prior posts about a "raw" sauce. The fresh flavor of good tomatoes shouldn't be obscured by the cooking process and/or a heavy hand with dried herbs (e.g., oregano). Personally, I'd prefer less, rather than more, sauce as too much would contribute to a mushy pie. But, I also think that cheese can also be overdone on a pizza. Too many toppings and you can't appreciate the flavor of the crust. Perhaps I'm in the minority here.
    #7
    RVlifestyle
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 01:02:35 (permalink)
    I just found this thread.. and want to add, if you are ever in Southern IN/IL a Bobes Pizza is a must.  We have family bring us several frozen when they come to visit.  And.. they never last long.  I grew up on these, and prefer the Bobes on 6th St. in Vincennes, and then the one in Lawrenceville...
    #8
    NYPIzzaNut
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 01:07:29 (permalink)
    Ciaoman

    I absolutely agree with prior posts about a "raw" sauce. The fresh flavor of good tomatoes shouldn't be obscured by the cooking process and/or a heavy hand with dried herbs (e.g., oregano). Personally, I'd prefer less, rather than more, sauce as too much would contribute to a mushy pie. But, I also think that cheese can also be overdone on a pizza. Too many toppings and you can't appreciate the flavor of the crust. Perhaps I'm in the minority here.

    Not in my book - pizzas start with the dough - the crust - if that crucial element of the the pie is not right the sauce and cheese are wasted in the effort to create a good pizza pie.

    #9
    rebeltruce
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 07:00:03 (permalink)
    NYPN,

    I agree the crust is the most important slice of the pie so to speak......then the sauce then the cheese.

    I have had excellent pizza made with nothing more then a can of 6IN1 crushed tomatoes, drained, with a pinch or two of good greek oregano and some sea salt, or a good old fashioned Pennsylvania sauce made with diluted tomato paste and a few herbs and spices added cooked for 30-45 minutes.

    The other key is a good hot oven....
    #10
    WarToad
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 08:51:10 (permalink)
    NYPIzzaNut
    ....
    Not in my book - pizzas start with the dough - the crust - if that crucial element of the the pie is not right the sauce and cheese are wasted in the effort to create a good pizza pie.


    Same here.  The crust is the foundation.  If it doesn't work, everything on top is wasted.
     
    As a kid in rural Iowa, my only exposure to pizza was either frozen (Tony's, LOL!) or a chain. (usually Pizza Hut, sometimes Domino's)  It wasn't until college in Iowa City where I as exposed to "The Sanctuary" which made a classic Itallian thin crust with a house sauce and fresh toppings.  It was like I'd never had pizza before.
    #11
    DawnT
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 10:55:56 (permalink)
    About 35 years ago, I worked for a few Pizza/Sub shops. The sauce was pretty much the same in both places. #10 can of ground tomatoes,#10 can of concentrated, crushed tomatoes w/ basil (this is usually called a pizza sauce base) ,water, the usual spices, S&P and oil . One of the places added a little fennel to the spices. That's it. Mixed in 5 gal. buckets with a paint stirrer and set aside for a day or two in the walk-in . This was a raw sauce. Deck ovens running full bore w/ the thermostat maxed out cooked the sauce and the pizza at the same time. Secret of the deck oven was the searing radiant heat from all sides that you can't duplicate with a home oven. Crust was a simple NY style water & yeast dough using a very high gluten flour that you can't buy retail made 25# bag at a time. You don't work this stuff, you fight it and it fights back. Thank goodness for machines, this isn't your typical all purpose or bread flour and it would probably ruin a heavy duty K.A. mixer. You probably can build a set of biceps working this dough by hand. Cheese was grated from blocks of whole milk moz. Counter and peels dusted with Semolina. Retarding/Proofing was done in boxes or stack cans. Doughs were never docked like you see the chains do now. No screens. Pie hit bare stone and turned once.

    #12
    ScreamingChicken
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 11:22:23 (permalink)
    WarToad
     
    As a kid in rural Iowa, my only exposure to pizza was either frozen (Tony's, LOL!) or a chain. (usually Pizza Hut, sometimes Domino's)


    No Paul Revere's???  When I was in school a common Sunday night dinner was a wedgie with pepperoni, sausage, mushrooms, extra cheese, and extra sauce.  Sadly, the Revere's in the next town over from me doesn't offer them; I called once and asked and was told I'd have to go to Iowa for one.
     
    Domino's for speed/convenience, Revere's for taste.
     
    Brad
    #13
    Russ Jackson
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 11:38:08 (permalink)
    rebeltruce

    NYPN,

    I agree the crust is the most important slice of the pie so to speak......then the sauce then the cheese.

    I have had excellent pizza made with nothing more then a can of 6IN1 crushed tomatoes, drained, with a pinch or two of good greek oregano and some sea salt, or a good old fashioned Pennsylvania sauce made with diluted tomato paste and a few herbs and spices added cooked for 30-45 minutes.

    The other key is a good hot oven....


    I can't agree with you more.
     
     

    Our original, multi-purpose tomato product, 6 IN 1 uses only the highest quality vine-ripened tomatoes, hand-selected and processed within hours of harvest, with no added citric acid or preservatives.
    All-Purpose Ground Tomatoes in Extra-Heavy Puree
    This versatile Escalon product has long been a favorite of pizza and pasta operators because of its sweet tomato flavor, bright natural color and thick, rich consistency. 6 IN 1 contains only vine-ripened, unpeeled ground tomatoes, extra-heavy purée and a touch of salt. It is so delightfully versatile you can use it in everything from soups and salsas to pizza and pasta sauces. 6 IN 1 was
    http://www.escalon.net/6in1.aspx
     
    A Top Quality Pizza Maker turned me on to these years ago. I use them in everything. Straight out of the can with a little salt and Parmasen Reggiano and Olive Oil.
    Heck I will eat them right out of the can. By far my favorite canned Tomato and I have tried dozens of different ones. I have even blended them down to make Bloody Mary Mix....Russ
    #14
    Davydd
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 11:38:09 (permalink)
    Sauce and cheese run the gamut in quality but in a pizza it is simply what you choose to go with that determines the quality of the pizza in those two. The dough is the art part of the pizza in how it is made and how it is baked. Using the same flour you can get widely different results.
    #15
    DawnT
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/26 13:21:33 (permalink)
    Escalon makes a great product but subjectively, Stanislaus seems to have a slightly richer taste. Just my opinion.
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    WarToad
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/28 11:25:48 (permalink)
    Brad_Olson

    WarToad
     
    As a kid in rural Iowa, my only exposure to pizza was either frozen (Tony's, LOL!) or a chain. (usually Pizza Hut, sometimes Domino's)


    No Paul Revere's???  When I was in school a common Sunday night dinner was a wedgie with pepperoni, sausage, mushrooms, extra cheese, and extra sauce.  Sadly, the Revere's in the next town over from me doesn't offer them; I called once and asked and was told I'd have to go to Iowa for one.
     
    Domino's for speed/convenience, Revere's for taste.
     
    Brad

     
    Oh, wow.  Blast from the past.  There was a Paul Revere's, and if we ordered from there, it was a wedgie!  Been a looooong time.  Thanks for the kick in the memory!

    #17
    cavandre
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/10/29 11:26:49 (permalink)
    A good crust can save a mediocre sauce...I don't find that it works the other way round.
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    leethebard
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/11/01 09:44:23 (permalink)
    Davydd

    Sauce and cheese run the gamut in quality but in a pizza it is simply what you choose to go with that determines the quality of the pizza in those two. The dough is the art part of the pizza in how it is made and how it is baked. Using the same flour you can get widely different results.


    That's about it...a quality dough,baked well...and quality cheese(buffalo milk!) and a fresh uncooked sauce...fresh vasil...a bit of Salt and pepper....and that's it!!!!Baked in a wood burning, very hot oven!!!
    #19
    Michael Hoffman
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/11/01 11:21:42 (permalink)
    Don't forget the oregano.
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    leethebard
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/11/01 17:47:17 (permalink)
    Just a pinch!
    #21
    cy_dugas
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    RE: It's In The Sauce 2009/11/01 19:13:48 (permalink)
    From a non-pizza part of the country, I have to say that the sauce, in my opinion, is just as important as the crust.  I personally like a simple but spicy sauce and a cracker thin crust.  Pizza in my neck of the woods concentrates on toppings, not sauce or crust.  I wish LA would have more options, but despite a few decent pizza places, we tend to rely on fast food pizza, which isn't really the same thing.

    cy
    #22
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