Menu help/critique

Hello,
I'm not sure if this is in the correct section or not.  If not, feel free to move it.  I am really excited about starting a food truck that specializes in breakfast.  Breakfast has always been my favorite meal and I REALLY enjoy cooking for large groups.  I know there are a million-and-one things to worry about before this point but I've had a few beers so now is as good a time as any to post my questions.
 
My goal is to not have a ton of variety but to excell at the few things on my menu.
 
Here's what I have so far:
 
Main Dishes
I've got various recipes but main ingrediants in my Omelettes would be:

• Ham/cheese
• Spicy Chicken
• Pulled Pork
• Philly Cheese Steak
• Salmon
• Crab
• Shrimp
• Veggie

 
Pre-made breakfast mini Po-boys
These would go on 2.5" or 3" Po-boy french bread depending on pricing.  I think there is room to grow here but keeping it simple is the main focus:
 

• Bacon/Egg/Cheese
• Sausage/Egg/Cheese
• Steak/Egg/Cheese
• Turkey/Egg/Cheese
• Ham/Egg/Cheese
• 2 eggs any style

 
Its just an idea but next time I make any of these, I want to try them with a hollandaise dipping sauce.  That might be something that makes these more fun.
 
Sides

• Duck fat home fries or hash browns(haven't decided yet)
• Biscuits/gravy
• Stone ground grits
• Silver dollar pancakes
• French toast sticks
• Bacon
• Sausage
• toast

 
Beverages
I know that this is the area where profits are made. 
I would ASSume that quality
Coffee
Juice
Milk
would be all that was needed but maybe I'm wrong...
 
 
 
In my head it would be awesome to have something similar to Denny's $2, $4, $6, $8 menus.  I would think that most people wouldn't want to spend $8-$10 on breakfast from a food truck so something geared towards cheaper prices would make more sense.  All of the ingredients are cheap, I wouldn't see why charging an arm/leg would be necessary.
 
My thoughts are to offer main dishes alone, Main dish with 1 side, and main dish with 2 sides for a good/competitive price and then profit off of the beverages.  I'm not sure if that's a winning formula but it's what I look for on the off chance that I go out for breakfast.
 
Please let me know what you think.  Feel free to add/remove anything that is pointless.  If this is all a dumb idea, let me know before I start spending money:)
 
 
Thanks in advance.
 
 

Derrick
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Where would you set up?
Your mini po boy, what's your thinking?....egg mcmuffin type sand?
I would have a breakfast burrito also.....potato, egg, cheese, choice of meat.....something along that line   good chorizo is also a good for breakfast burritos.
Make a couple of signature salsas to go in them.
A good biscuits & gravy can't be beat. IT MUST BE GREAT! or don't do it.
For breakfast, I would only have a few things, and do them very well.
You say all the ingredients are cheap.... look again, go do some price shopping. Bought bacon latley?
Decent ham will cost you $3.50lb, Great ham will be much more..... smoked salmon, crab & shrimp $$$$, cheese $$,
duck fat to cook those spuds in, Potatoes themself are running $15-20 a case, they were 1/3 that 6 months ago.
 
A big mistake,,, don't go pricing your menu like Denny's does, they have huge buying power, you don't.
If you are going to do a food tuck in Seattle, I would think you need to be the best breakfast I can get.
I don't see anything on your menu that I can't get at 50 other places on the West Side besides the potatoes in duck fat.

chefbuba


Where would you set up?
Your mini po boy, what's your thinking?....egg mcmuffin type sand?
I would have a breakfast burrito also.....potato, egg, cheese, choice of meat.....something along that line   good chorizo is also a good for breakfast burritos.
Make a couple of signature salsas to go in them.
A good biscuits & gravy can't be beat. IT MUST BE GREAT! or don't do it.
For breakfast, I would only have a few things, and do them very well.
You say all the ingredients are cheap.... look again, go do some price shopping. Bought bacon latley?
Decent ham will cost you $3.50lb, Great ham will be much more..... smoked salmon, crab & shrimp $$$$, cheese $$,
duck fat to cook those spuds in, Potatoes themself are running $15-20 a case, they were 1/3 that 6 months ago.

A big mistake,,, don't go pricing your menu like Denny's does, they have huge buying power, you don't.
If you are going to do a food tuck in Seattle, I would think you need to be the best breakfast I can get.
I don't see anything on your menu that I can't get at 50 other places on the West Side besides the potatoes in duck fat.

 
 

Well, you've brought up a problem that I've been running into in my searches, and that is what the acutual cost of items are from the wholesaler.  The only thing I have to go off of is prices from internet "wholesalers" such as foodservicedirect.com.  Until I know the price of what I'd be paying from a local distributer, I have no way of knowing how cheap/expensive things are.  Of course there are standard retail prices but if I was going to be paying those prices there would be no point of looking into this.

With the mini po-boys, yeah they would be similar to an egg mcmuffin.
 
I understand that I shouldn't try and compete with Denny's or anyone else that has more buying power than me, but I don't see a reason for a $10 breakfast.  I can make anything that I have listed for a lot less than that if I was going to break it down to individual portions.
 
As far as the potatos in duck fat.  They're nothing new.  I just think they're a more tasty way to cook spuds.
 
You commented on being able to get anything I listed at anyone of 50 places in Seattle.  I get that but I also don't feel like there needs to be any frills/gimmicks with breakfast.  When I go out for breakfast I'm never looking for new menu items, what really sets a place apart from the rest for me is the quality of the product.  I don't know if I'm alone in my way of thinking but I would think that potential customers feel the same way.

For saying you don't want a ton of variety in your menu, you sure have a ton of variety in your menu!!! Unless you're planning on doing only 2 or 3 items in a category per day on a rotating basis, Your menu looks too broad.
Is it your plan to try to catch people on their way to work?
If so, then you need a location with heavy foot traffic, like between mass transit stops and offices and you need a quick "Grab & Go" Menu. Most people are in a hurry on their way to work. They won't wait very long!
As you know, Seattle is the Coffee Capital of the World. The people there are Coffee Crazies! SeaTac is the largest coffee consumption city in America! You better have Damn Good Coffee. According to the Yellow Pages, there are 784 Coffee Shops in Seattle! Many sell Breakfast food items, bake goods etc. I would think that's going to be your major Competition not Dennys or the fast food chains. I'm sure people in Seattle have their favorite coffee shops----tough to break their current patterns of buying.
The #1 rule of Retailing ALWAYS APPLIES - Location, Location, Location! No Foot Traffic----No Business!
My formula for success for this type of business in this order:
1. Location
2. Quality
3. Pricing
4. Fast Service. 
5. Menu
If you can't do every one of these well, then consider another venture.

Just a footnote, consider adding coke and diet coke to your menu. I've walked out of breakfast places because all they sell is coffee and juice.

I also think your menu is too broad. Unless you are having 2 or 3 cooks in the kitchen, I don't see how you will keep up. I learned a long time ago that breakfast is a high-labor sale. I can cook 6 or 8 cheeseburgers with less actual labor than one person's complete breakfast. And people are not willing to spend the money on breakfast that they are on other meals, at least around here.

I sell breakfast, but I only do it because I'm in my trailer that early doing prep work anyway, so I might as well serve customers if they are coming by. But I'd never try to run a breakfast-only place. Just my opinion, but its a fast way to lose your shirt.

The only issue I see is Omelets and the sides.  Most of the time,  if breakfast is not eaten at home then it is an on-the-go meal.  I can eat a sandwich and a coffee while walking or driving, but an omelet and coffee needs three hands to handle, not to mention pancakes.  Without providing seating, unless you are in an area where people will be buying then going right into their office to eat, then those items might not sell well.
 
Just my opinion
 
al
 
 

• Pulled Pork $1.53 LB  with shrinkage double the price. So your paying $3.06 per lb and that's the cheapest item on your list.
• Salmon  high food cost item
• Crab    high food cost item
• Shrimp  Really high food cost item

If I were to reopen today I'd make a new menu that would be very small but full of great taste.
Jack

For "costing" your menu, you need to figure your "highest" price for emergency restock AND your normal  supplier pricing. Try to get prices from Sam's Clubs/Costco. We have found that they are pretty close to the big suppliers that want nothing to do with us (too small). The big suppliers sometimes costs more because they are delivering. Don't forget to "round up" a little so that you can handle a few supply increased with out having to reset your prices every month (or week).

I have told David... NO MORE BREAKFAST. Too much hassle. I want to make things easier on us, not harder.

Foodbme


For saying you don't want a ton of variety in your menu, you sure have a ton of variety in your menu!!! Unless you're planning on doing only 2 or 3 items in a category per day on a rotating basis, Your menu looks too broad.
Is it your plan to try to catch people on their way to work?
If so, then you need a location with heavy foot traffic, like between mass transit stops and offices and you need a quick "Grab & Go" Menu. Most people are in a hurry on their way to work. They won't wait very long!
As you know, Seattle is the Coffee Capital of the World. The people there are Coffee Crazies! SeaTac is the largest coffee consumption city in America! You better have Damn Good Coffee. According to the Yellow Pages, there are 784 Coffee Shops in Seattle! Many sell Breakfast food items, bake goods etc. I would think that's going to be your major Competition not Dennys or the fast food chains. I'm sure people in Seattle have their favorite coffee shops----tough to break their current patterns of buying.
The #1 rule of Retailing ALWAYS APPLIES - Location, Location, Location! No Foot Traffic----No Business!
My formula for success for this type of business in this order:
1. Location
2. Quality
3. Pricing
4. Fast Service. 
5. Menu
If you can't do every one of these well, then consider another venture.

Very good points! Thank you very much!
As far as the variety goes. The way I look at it is that a large portion of items can be prepped the night before or right before the window opens which leaves only a couple items to be made on the spot.
 
The sandwhiches and grits can all be prepped the night before and just warmed in the morning.
Items like bacon, sausage, pancakes, french toast, biscuits can be be cooked in large quantities right before the window goes up with ease and kept in warmers. With that, they can also be replenished with relative ease as orders are being filled. I've never met a complicated piece of bacon or a pancake that i had to put much thought into.
 
That really just leaves eggs and home fries/hash browns being made on the spot. I hate eggs that have been sitting out for a while(buffet style)so I have to assume the average customer feels the same way. Hash browns are the same way. Having all the ingredients at your disposal takes omelet making down to a few minutes on a hot griddle. Same goes for over hard/over medium/over easy or scrambled eggs. As long as there is a hot pot of water going on the burner, there is no reason why poached eggs can't be whipped up quickly if/when needed.
 
Coffee is going to take research. I've never been a coffee drinker so I can't assume anything about what makes a good or what makes a bad cup. Being in Seattle, there is competition at every corner, and because of my lack of knowledge I would definitely need to rely on sites like this and general word of mouth when scouting out a product that is going to sell.
 
Location is another thing that is just going to take research. I don't think there is an easy method of finding the "perfect" spot(s). I know there is foot traffic all over the city but it will take a ton of time scouting to find those few spots that are in need of quality breakfast.
 
 

If I was served a breakfast sandwich that was made the night before, reheated and held in a warmer, I would throw it through the window back at you,  anyone can get a reheated sandwich from the local convenience store, you want to operate a food truck. COOK.
As far as food prices, go look at Restaurant Depot, one in Seattle, one in Fife.
For coffee, it is a must with breakfast, either you need to start drinking it, and educating yourself, or have someone that you can rely on to be on the truck that does know and appreciate coffee.

This is the type of feedback I was looking for.  Thanks everyone!
 
What I'm seeing is that most of the answers are telling me to think smaller(in terms of menu size) but with better quality selections.  Am I reading that correctly? 
 
Chefbuba, thanks for the tip on Restaurant Depot.  When I get an account set up with them, I'll go and take a look at their prices.
 
 

I agree completely with Al. Food from a truck means food eaten with hands most of the time. I wouldn't do much you can't eat with your hands. BUT... get a good hearty roll and do omelette sandwiches. I like the idea of a breakfast wrap. Find a good breakfast sausage and make pigs in a blanket (4-inch pancakes wrapped around a breakfast sausage, served 3 to a serving with maple syrup dipping cup).

There are more unique and interesting breakfast finger foods... just think outside the box. What about stuffed crepes? Yum!

But, really... unless you have seating, keep the fork-fed items to a minimum.

Hum  ... I thought you were describing a Breakfast Buffet;   ... So this maybe a bit much from a truck.   The items that require a plate & fork to eat, is difficult to handle with one hand, standing up.  

I'm in  A different situation with our reg. spot, but we sell a ton of b-fast items. i've been asked to do omelets, pancakes, waffles,and frech toast, whew! with just a 24" grill it's full most times with grease  lol... right now we do b-fast sandwich's, (bacon, sausage) biscuits & gravy, oatmeal,big breakfasts,i/e 2 eggs any style, w/ bacon or sausage toast, home fries, & breakfast burritos and thats plenty ! i serve from 5:45 till 9:45 then close from 9:45 till 10:45 to set up for lunch

Take a clue from the fast food chains that serve breakfast. How many items are on their breakfast menu? For example, Jack in the Box has 14 items on their menu, HOWEVER, many of those items use the same ingredients. For example, The Bacon, Egg & Cheese Biscuit and the Sausage, Egg & Cheese Biscuit. The only difference is the Sausage or Bacon. Cuts down on the number of items you need to buy, store and pay for and throw out. Same with the Croissants - Only variable is the meat.
Mcdonalds, same thing. 21 items but most of them use the same ingredients. English muffins, eggs,  burritos etc.
The lesson to be learned---- cut down on your SKU's and build a "TAKE WITH HAND FOOD" menu with interchangeable products.Remember, you're in this to make money, not impress people with your expansive menu. Every additional food ingredient you add costs you money and increases your chance of losing money thru spoilage and waste.
BTW, both of these chains have more storage space than you and they both do big Breakfast business.
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My thoughts are to offer main dishes alone, Main dish with 1 side, and main dish with 2 sides for a good/competitive price and then profit off of the beverages.  I'm not sure if that's a winning formula but it's what I look for on the off chance that I go out for breakfast.
Here's where I think your thinking is flawed. "Going out for breakfast" is an entirely different thing than grabbing something to eat on the way to work. When I think about "Going out to Breakfast", I'm not thinking about going to a food truck. I'm pre-planning and going to a sit down restaurant. To me, a food truck is a convenience store on wheels. It's handy to where I'm going and serves good food at a reasonable price. Others may disagree but that's my opinion. The only option would be knowing of a place where multiple food trucks gather on specific days and you have a broad assortment of food from various trucks available.   

breakfast burrito....sausage/scramble/cheese/green,red peppers/onions/hashbrowns
breakfast sandwich.... sausage/egg/cheese.....bacon/egg/cheese.....ham/egg/cheese
breakfast goodies.... sausage "corn dogs"....french toast sticks
 
6 "big" items covers all your breakfast needs
bacon/sausage/ham/eggs/cheese/hashbrowns
peppers and onions can carry over to lunch menu if possible
 
sandwich bread is mini hoagie type rolls, toasted for breakfast/steamed for small lunch sandwiches
 
sausage "corn dogs" are links dipped in a little waffle batter....french toast speaks for itself :)
 
so 4 of the total of 8 breakfast items carry right over into lunch :) easy peezy
 

dont forget to offer a ham egg and cheeseburger for breakfast !
try one, you will understand why :)
 
the burrito is your heavy hitter item, maybe offer two sizes for the hungry guy....
the sammies are your basic "regular" hitters....
and the goodies are for the sweet tooth :)
 
should pretty much cover everything/everyone 

Here's where you can get Mobile Food Industry insights:
http://www.mobilefoodnews.com/
According to this web site, apparently Porland OR is pretty Food Truck Friendly. Take a ride down there and talk to the operators.

I'm glad I asked questions.
You guys are awesome!
Thanks for all the advice!!!

Foodbme

According to this web site, apparently Porland OR is pretty Food Truck Friendly. Take a ride down there and talk to the operators.

 
Portland loves their street food, but they have far more food carts as opposed to food trucks. The difference being, the trucks move around from location to location every day, the carts are more of a permanent structure which is parked in groups called pods.
 
To throw in a little vote for my site, check out http://mobile-cuisine.com for news and information regarding the mobile food industry as well.
 
-MC

MobileCuisine

Foodbme

According to this web site, apparently Portland OR is pretty Food Truck Friendly. Take a ride down there and talk to the operators.

Portland loves their street food, but they have far more food carts as opposed to food trucks. The difference being, the trucks move around from location to location every day, the carts are more of a permanent structure which is parked in groups called pods.
To throw in a little vote for my site, check out http://mobile-cuisine.com for news and information regarding the mobile food industry as well.
-MC

THANX! for your web site. I'm sure it can be of interest to our Mobile Food Brethren. I've bookmarked it
I opened your Phoenix Food Truck Link and there's nothing there. Here's a link to their Coalition blogspot if you want to contact them for listings.
http://phxstreetfood.blogspot.com/
OOOOOPS! They moved from the blogspot to:
http://phxstreetfood.org/
I guess that's why they call it "MOBILE" Food!