Mobile Vendor Question- A little different

I've been researching the hot dog cart business for a while and will be getting a hot dog cart once I get all of my finances in line. Should happen by summer.

I have a safety question. How many of you folks have a CCL (Conceal Carry License) and carry a weapon for self defense? I plan on carrying mine , since I do almost everywhere else I go. Have you ever had situations where a customer or person in your area made you feel uneasy? How would you deal with situations like this? Wherever you have money there is an opportunity for someone to try and take it from you. Safetey tips also welcome. Your feedback is appreciated and is helping me prepare to get out there and make this work.

Thanks

Arnie Tx
I was robbed once, they took about 20 Dollars I kept in a Blue Bag. Kept the rest in my Pockets. My question to you is what are you going to do shoot someone. over $50.00? If you need the gun to sell hot dogs, then I'd stop selling. IMHO CBB

quote:

Originally posted by Cowboy Bob in PA
Arnie Tx
I was robbed once, they took about 20 Dollars I kept in a Blue Bag. Kept the rest in my Pockets. My question to you is what are you going to do shoot someone. over $50.00?

YUP, if they're trying to rob me sure would!

I know guns are very visible in TX, although I wonder; Do you holster it? Keep it in its own spot on the cart? Under your shorts waste band in the summer? Do you practice a quick draw when they are holding you up with a gun? Or how about a good old scatter gun to blast em away?

With a hot dog cart out on the street on a dark night maybe its more chancey and maybe more holdups, Although the FBI shows the convince stores have the high rate of holdups. Do all grocery stores and restaurants than have guns under the counters for holdups? Who else gets shot during the shoot out? The recommendations I've seen is its not worth the money compared to yours or someone else's life, just hand it over. RJF

Cowboy Bob- Man that stinks. Glad you didn't get hurt.

In Texas your weapon must be concealed on your person or property. As far as defending myself, that all depends on the situation. If you point a gun or a knife at me, I don't see much choice in the matter. At that point it becomes life or death. Hope it never happens but this ain't a perfect world. If I could get a guarantee from the bad guy that he won't just shoot me well.....doubt that's reliable.

If you do get into a situation, have you planned for it? Does anybody carry MACE? They make some nifty dispensers these days and that can incapacitate a person if needed from 15'-20'. Give you time to run away.

Just pondering life's realities and this business.

You're obviously a CCL holder, so I see nothing at all unusual or wrong with regard to you being armed while working. I'll say this: The course you might have taken to qualifiy for your CCL is just flat not enough considering the fact that you are putting yourself in a position to be a target. I would highly recommend Gunsite. http://www.gunsite.com/courses/pistol.html

Arnie,

The answers to all your questions can be found by taking and passing a professional defense handgun course. Untrained and using deadly force don't mix. Every situation is different and the sharing of experiences is discouraged on most of the conceal carry and handgun forums. Deadly force should only be used as last resort when one's life is in imminent danger. I live in Wisconsin. There is no conceal carry. However, the state constitution allows the right to bear arms to protect one's home and one's business. The best non lethal self defense is a product called Guardian Angel made by Kimber. About the size of a small cell phone, this unit will stop threats at a distance up to 13 feet with two blasts of ultra-hot pepper jet gel, which is extremely hot(399,000 Scoville Heat Units-SVH at the nozzle) with a velocity of 90mph. It penetrates around glasses into eyes, pores, and membranes causing temporary blindness, gagging, and pain for up to 45 minutes. $40 retail at Ganger Mountain. www.life-act.com/guardianangel.php

CSD PhD-Professor of Hot Dogs

I live in Arizona we have a open carry law I myself have a ccw and proudly carry a smith and wesson model 60 and a kal-tec 380 for a back up. I peel off my cash so I never have more than $30.00 in one pocket at a time which I would gladly give up if I had to choose between killing someone or being out a few bucks. Regardless for me it is not worth killing some idiot for $30.00 or a $100.00 considering that you still have to get a lawyer and prove in court that it was a justifble kill and that will cost you thousands. As I am sure that you remember from your ccw class that you shoot to kill as if you mame them they can sue you. Plus by doing this then it is your word against a man who cannot defend himself in court that day because you killed him. You have to figure that if someone pulls a gun on you and says give up your cash there alot more scared than you are and it can go bad real quick. Keep your cool control the situation and give them the $30.00 that you peeled off. They'll take it and run. But if they say all of it and start waving a weapon in your face you need to decide are you locked and loaded is your weapon easily accessable so you can say yeah here you go get a round off before they do. Personally, I like to sleep at night. I'd say here you go and either give up the cash or hit them with the pepper spray that I always carry in my pocket which I wouldn't think twice about using the instant that I felt threatend I would gladly spray them blind and then take my time beating the crap out of them while waiting for the cops to arrive instead of killing them. I was taught in the advance deadly force classes I took that it is better to control the situation and not wait it out to see which way it goes. If this means giving up your money and everyone get to go home, then you still won your alive. The odds are against you if you pull out a weapon when the other guy already has the draw on you. Be kinda like forcing his hand. You would present him with no other choice than to shoot you. It's a tough call. One I pray that I never have to make.

Thanks for your feedback. I've got my license in 98' and have never had any issues.

Maybe I should have asked , does this profession involve a higher degree of risk similar to convenience store workers? I know it's situational and there are a lot of variables but I'm curious to know how many people on this board have actually experienced a bad situation.

Perhaps we can learn something.

Hot Dog - Thanks for the tips on handling money. That's a good tip.

Naa it is all good! you'll be fine. Hell everyone around here thinks that the "Weiner Man" is just poor white trash and that you can't make no money doing this. Which is most likely why I get tipped a extra buck or two a couple of times a day and that is fine by me. LOL!! Don't sweat it, but then again use common sense and don't put yourself in a position to be a target for criminals either.

Good thread.

I've been exploring this question myself.

I've been in business just under a year and work the late night bar crowd 3-5 nights a week. I've gotten into 2 altercations in the last year, but neither one were really dangerous or alarming, just late night drunken idiots that are too sloshed to even stand up, much less fight. The cops show up and ask if I want to press charges, I say no, and the person shows up the next week, apologetic and embarrassed.

Two weeks ago I had an altercation that changed my mind. I has some big tall angry thug in my face, who was clearly on the verge of attacking me. It made me scared, both of that situation and my own stubborn unwillingness to back down to idiots who are behaving inappropriately.

After asking people who are versed in the law (here in Kentucky), as well as folks who are experts in the field of self defense I've come the same conclusion as CSD, that a GOOD pepper gel is the best way to defend oneself.

I think if I worked nights I may be feeding the cops for free in return for some "presence" every now and then if rowdy crowds were expected. Getting to know the local law enforcement is always a benefit anytime.

quote:

Originally posted by rickmalek


After asking people who are versed in the law (here in Kentucky), as well as folks who are experts in the field of self defense I've come the same conclusion as CSD, that a GOOD pepper gel is the best way to defend oneself.

If you go that route you'd better have at least two units, because the bozo attacking you may have a pal or two.

I work a local dive bar here 3 night a week and Yes drunken idiots are a problem and also a major source of entertainment. My biggest fear is that there going to fall on my table or knock my cart over. 2 weeks ago there was this fool from New Zealand that was gong off on this other drunk about how America sucks and we are all loosers and Blah, Blah, Blah. I listened to his crap for about 5 minutes and was amazed that the other guy just stood there and took it. I leaned across my table and grabed him and told him if he don't like it here go home. I was beyond pissed off and the bouncers grabbed him and sent him on his way.(they told me later that they were sure that if they didn't step in that I was going to beat the crap out of him) 5 minutes later he was back and I was thinking oh great here we go. He bought 3 hot dogs tipped me 10 bucks and would not leave me alone pouring his guts out to me that he can't go home because he married a American women and would not be able to get back in America if he went home and his wife refuses to leave. but then on the other hand..... When the bar closes and you look in your steamer and tell them that you only have polish or brats left and they want a hot dog well I go home empty every time..

I feed the bouncers free dog meat. I don't carry doughnuts on my cart to feed the cops

I'm actually getting my FID course out of the way this weekend. I can handle a gun but have no intention of carrying. Here in Massachusetts, though, you need to take the gun safety course and get the license in order to carry pepper spray... which I do intend to keep in my pocket... next to my money.

I also don't intend to be alone on the ball field where I'll be working... I plan to close up as the last couple innings approach, so the guys will still be around.

I repo'd cars for 18 years and although I was on the big hole side of a few guns in that career I never carried a weapon. My thoughts were that if I had one I'd need one. Never did. I like CSD's answer. But then again I don't work nights (much) and no one really knows how much the poor hot dog guy makes.

I like Michael Hoffman's suggestion of two. They clip onto your belt and weigh next to nothing.

CSD- I have Kimbers latest catalog and was looking at those today while drooling over a couple of 1911s. Probably going to buy my wife one since she isn't comfy carrying with 4 kids around.

Until today I hadn't realized how far this type of technology has come. Looks good, everyone should have one for self defense.

Thanks

BTW - I get the feeling around here that shooting someone is justifiable if they ask for ketchup.

Street cops carry chemical deterrents that are more effective then anything available to civilians. Ask one how many times he/she has deployed it to no avail, especially when the bad guy is high on drugs. I’m not saying do not carry such a device but be aware that they are not cure alls. I think the Kimber model is very good for civilians, some of my cop friends carry them off duty but they also have a concealed gun. And yes, if someone is holding a weapon on me my life is at risk and I will shoot them, regardless of the amount of money involved. I carry a gun every day and shoot about a thousand rounds per month practicing and competing in self defensive competitions involving drawing from concealment.

quote:

Originally posted by ArnieTX

BTW - I get the feeling around here that shooting someone is justifiable if they ask for ketchup.

My S&W 340pd, chambered with .357 ammo, is just perfect for char broiling hot dogs.

CSD

CSD- Sweet, .357 out of a snubby is quite a ride. I've been looking for a BUG. Been considering the SW scandiums and airweight models. Leaning toward the SW642 for the jacket pocket in cool weather. Would ride good in the pocket. Carried a Para P12 for years but getting the bug to carry something diff.

http://www.snubnose.info/docs/m642.htm

Arnie,
The only thing no one has suggested here is that a very public sign is also a good deterrant. Thieves, being cowards, always take the path of least resistance. it's true that you will not be looked upon as a high-take hit for a thief, but perhaps a subtle little sign like,
"On this cart Mrs. SMITH don't bake pies
And Mr. WESSON don't make cookin'oil"
might be all you need.
WingmanBBF

Your primary weapon is your mind. A gun is a tool, and can be a useful tool, but first and foremost a guy's got be be on the lookout for trouble and avoid it if possible.

I would not kill a man over a hot dog or ten bucks or ten thousand bucks. The only occasion to use deadly force is in defense of human life.

This is my weapon and this is my gun and I sell hot dogs just for fun!!!