Helpful ReplyMobile kitchen build info

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THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/10 20:50:17 (permalink)
chefbuba

Dog, why the 2 90's from the p-trap to the tank? Couldn't you eliminate them?
 
Also, fine tune your drops to the hopper before you glue everything,  run some water down each drain, watch where the water comes out of the pipe, meaning you are only dumping small amounts of water down the pipe, therefore it will want to flow from the low, or bottom of the pipe to the hopper,,,,, looks like your going to have a wet floor as of now..
The clocer to dead center, the better....


Good call on the test water. The pic may look like it might blow all over the floor, but I assure you it's a bad angle... lol. I made sure there is ample space and everything lines up as much as it can to the center of that drain. :-)

I'm probably going to glue it all tomorrow after the run.

The 90's had to be put in b/c I couldn't do a straight run, it would have ran across the edge of the base, so I had to bend it to get it to center under the sinks.  Small trailer = gally kitchen, but that's not really a bad thing b/c everything is within reach.
post edited by THE WILD DOG - 2010/03/10 21:00:29
KonaErnie
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/10 21:11:28 (permalink)
THE WILD DOG

chefbuba

Dog, why the 2 90's from the p-trap to the tank? Couldn't you eliminate them?

Also, fine tune your drops to the hopper before you glue everything,  run some water down each drain, watch where the water comes out of the pipe, meaning you are only dumping small amounts of water down the pipe, therefore it will want to flow from the low, or bottom of the pipe to the hopper,,,,, looks like your going to have a wet floor as of now..
The clocer to dead center, the better....


Good call on the test water. The pic may look like it might blow all over the floor, but I assure you it's a bad angle... lol. I made sure there is ample space and everything lines up as much as it can to the center of that drain. :-)

I'm probably going to glue it all tomorrow after the run.

The 90's had to be put in b/c I couldn't do a straight run, it would have ran across the edge of the base, so I had to bend it to get it to center under the sinks.  Small trailer = gally kitchen, but that's not really a bad thing b/c everything is within reach. 


Dog....You could eliminate the 90° elbows by rotating the hopper 45° right where it sits and use a 45° elbow into the tank. Just a thought.
post edited by KonaErnie - 2010/03/10 21:18:15
Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 00:15:55 (permalink)
I was thinking of either silconing them together, ( only issue with that is if I have to take them out.

Right and when you have to repair something you have a mess on your hands. Or worse yet when you have allowed a bunch of very small particles of food waste go down your drain in your sinks and you have to fight to take out your waste water tank in order to clean it, it becomes a chore and that always happens in the 2nd day of a 3 day event.

No disrespect meant to Ernie but "Plumbers Tape Sucks.

Go to any hardware store and get a 90 degree bracket like you'd use on a shelf (the longer the better) and screw one to the wall for your top tank, and one screwed to the floor for the bottom tank and you should be good to go, in securing your tanks. I have found they really don't shift as much as you'd expect.

Keep in mind everything you put into your rig is going to "Have to be removed for maintenance" at some point, so you need to make a good decision on strength VS  maintenance, during your build. Never wield anything that can be glued. Or in other words don't put it together so that you can't take it apart in the future. 

And I mean YOU, because if you have a friend design and put it together and then in 6 months your in another county, or state, and hes not there with you who are you going to depend on to fix it? I learned this from experience. And along the same lines no two plumbers do things alike.

Jack


THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 02:41:51 (permalink)
I was thinking the brackets would work best. I don't really have to worry bout the waste tank, it's about 39" + the length of the inlet pipe. The only way those babies are coming out is if I remove the support stud from the base and remove the right side panel. Also would have to remove the far right flange from the sink and remove the drain pipe. I don't plan on cementing the flanges anyway, just the pipes. I don't think it will be a problem since I'm using compression fittings on them anyways. I have to redo my supply line runs anyway, I wanted to run 2 individual lines, one for the colds, & one for the hots, branching off of the out post on the water pump. I have a final blueprint of my plumbing now that I have dry fitted everything. I don't see anything wrong with the runs. I'm sure the water will pull for the hots just the same as it would for the colds. I don't know much about how on demand stuff works, but I see no reason why it wouldn't work, but I will post my plumbing runs on here to see if anyone see's any reason why it wouldn't work properly.  I also plan on keeping a tool box with some replacement fittings, small container of glue and tools, just in case I need anything on the fly. I have room underneath the sink to keep it there.

Also I'm looking for 90degree suitcase latches for my counter tops. I know they exist, I just can't seem to find them. I saved a browswer link for them, but when i blew out my pc, i lost it :-(  LOL


THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 03:05:38 (permalink)
As I am nearing my gas line runs. I'm curious about regulators. I'll be running no more than 100,000 Btu's an hour  ( I would think)  How many regulators would I need ? I'm thinking about putting one on the outside with the tanks, and one where the manifold will be that branches off in 3 different area's. ( well 2 of them will just run straight up ) the third one will run the length of the trailer to the water heater. I plan on stopping about 3-5 feet before the water heater and just use a regular propane hose from there and glasp it down to the studs or wall partition that i put up if I decide NOT to paint :-)

Serious help on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks to everyone who's helped get this far.
Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 08:34:42 (permalink)
I'm no pro propane or gas guy, but I think one regulator is all you'll need. Or if you need more one per appliance would be the answer. But to be sure call a local propane gas supplier and ask them. They will want the length of your gas line run, the inside diameter of the pipe and the BTUs of each appliance. I have one regulator at the tank, on my trailer.

Jack
chefbuba
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 10:41:22 (permalink)
Dog,   Just looking at the specs on my rig, 290,000 BTU draw from all appliances, have 1 750,000 BTU 2 stage regulator. Approx 27' of 3/4" pipe, includes flex lines. 2 #100 tanks.
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 11:33:28 (permalink)
You think it's best to use flex lines instead of the standard LP connection &  3/4 iron ?  I'll have a total of about 20 feet.
post edited by THE WILD DOG - 2010/03/11 11:38:07
chefbuba
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 12:06:04 (permalink)
Are you talking flex for the whole run?, I would only use rigid pipe to the base with a shut off valve , run flex from there to the appliance. Might be code too.
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 13:24:04 (permalink)
Do they make 6 feet flex pipe ?  I was planning on using the 3/4 " black iron. I will have to look at the rigid pipe...  They sell that at Lowes ? lol
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 13:46:04 (permalink)
DRAIN TEST: 100% pass, it all made it in with a tad adjustment to the second to last drain spout on the right. had to angle it more. Now to rip it apart and do the supply lines, and set it in place.
chefbuba
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/11 22:49:57 (permalink)
THE WILD DOG

Do they make 6 feet flex pipe ?  I was planning on using the 3/4 " black iron. I will have to look at the rigid pipe...  They sell that at Lowes ? lol


By rigid I meant non flexible. Use the black pipe or galvanized, what ever is allowed.
 
Flex lines come in different lengths.
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/12 00:37:09 (permalink)
I think I'm going to to try & attempt to build my own exhaust hood. I've been doing some research and it seems that all the hoods are built out of 304 stainless. I can get 304 stainless backsplash in the same gauge for about $50 a sheet.

Now I'm just really thinking outloud on this one. I can get a 12 volt shutter fan that can produce 1750CFM. Anyone have any suggestions on bending or any other suggestions ?
AZdog
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 05:26:03 (permalink)
THE WILD DOG

Do they make 6 feet flex pipe ?  I was planning on using the 3/4 " black iron. I will have to look at the rigid pipe...  They sell that at Lowes ? lol


Keep in mind that flex pipe is easily 10x more expensive than using black iron.  I have about 14 feet of black iron going from the outside of my trailer, up through the Ansul system, and then a couple of 90degrees - then I use a shut off at the terminal of the iron pipe and run a flex pipe from the shut off up to the appliance.

Oh, and I also use flex pipe going from the LPG regulator to the black pipe inlet.

I think off the top of my head, a 3/4" flex pipe (the yellow coated ones) about 2' long was about $40.

About one of your other questions - I use a 2 stage LPG regulator commonly found in RV's.  I draw about 150,000btu and it's good for up to 160,000 - cost about $25.
post edited by AZdog - 2010/03/13 05:29:24
lornaschinske
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 10:32:01 (permalink)
THE WILD DOG
Also I'm looking for 90degree suitcase latches for my counter tops. I know they exist, I just can't seem to find them. I saved a browswer link for them, but when i blew out my pc, i lost it :-(  LOL
 


Austin Hardware will have pretty much any hardware that you are looking for... including the trailer hardware that you see on those commercial cargo trailers.  You will probably pay for it though.  They are not the cheapest but they do have everything.  They even had the turnbuckle latches for my 1974 Apache pop-up that NO ONE had ever seen. 
Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 11:32:19 (permalink)
Lorna, made a good point and I'd like to add a thought. If you don't know what something is called but know what you need it to do, or what you need done go to a good hardware site, and browse until you find what you need.

Then you have a base price and the exact name of the item, so from there you can do a search and find a better price, free shipping, an auction, or what ever.

It takes a lot of time but it really works

Jack
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 15:28:12 (permalink)
DR, I do that all the time with google images. I search the pics to find what I need. I have no clue of the proper names for half the stuff I needed. LOL I know now though.  I just realized that I am pretty much done my build. I was going over everything that needed to be done, I was shocked. Once the gas lines go in, that's pretty much it. I'm going to pull the bases out and spray bomb everything once it dries up out here. Been raining for 2 days now.

LORNA I'm gonnna check out that site now.

AZ, I'm not sure what a terminal is. My shut off valve the way I have it scoped out in my mind, is that it's going to enter the trailer from the floor ( thanks to the DR on that one ) come across about 18" of base, 90 up a stud, shut off valve will protrude from panel on the left. then T off going to the water heater ( 6 foot run ) and then back towards the front of the trailer, 90 again towards the floor and then Uturn to face upwards from the floor and that's where I will have my " manifold " connection for the  cooker & griddle hook ups.  I plan to use  a 2" pipe attached to  a T & a 90 with 1" pipes sticking up for the connections.  If you can envision it. LOL  I'll go to Lowe's and build it and take a pic to show you later today for better understanding.
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 19:15:28 (permalink)
With the appropriate gas hook ups I intend to use this as my LP manifold for 2 LP hook ups.  Does anyone see any issues from this ? It's 3/4" Iron. I couldn't find the nipples or other pieces to hook up to show & I got tired of waiting for guy to come around.


Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 20:17:56 (permalink)
The Wild Dog wrote "Gas line will enter the trailer from the floor come across about 18" of base, 90 up a stud, shut off valve will protrude from panel on the left. then T off going to the water heater ( 6 foot run ) and then back towards the front of the trailer, 90 again towards the floor and then Uturn to face upwards from the floor and that's where I will have my " manifold " connection for the  cooker & griddle hook ups.  I plan to use  a 2" pipe attached to  a T & a 90 with......."

Wow I'm lost but I once saw a 3 Stooges movie when they had the gas coming out the faucets and the water coming out of the gas stove burner.
106 THE PLUMBER'S FRIEND
Plumbers Moe, Larry & Curly Joe are hired to fix a leaky spicket while the owner is away. Cutting off the water doesn't mean to cut off the pipes, and a leak soon escalates into a flood.
Live Action Segment:   ELECTRICIANS

LOL I know your smarter than that. Just kidding. 

But really I'm not sure I understand and I do think pictures or line drawings like you posted in the past would help if it's not a pain.

But my first thought was why not use a "T" from your line runing under the trailer to each appliance. You'd "T"  from your main line going from the gas source to  your water heater and where that line goes through the floor a shutoff valve then a flex line to the water heater.

Then go down the line (under the trailer) and another hole through the floor again a shut off valve and flex pipe to your manifold?

But it may be that I just don't understand what the situation is or your plan.
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/13 20:57:13 (permalink)
I whipped this up real quick.  I'm not sure if I feel safe with running the gas lines under the trailer, for road hazzard safety.  Any thoughts ?

Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/14 00:12:20 (permalink)
Run them under the trailer. What is a road hazard? If you see something in the road your going to slow down, move over or stop. The old tire road hazard thing for safety, deals with the 50s and 60s. How often do you run over something and it punctures all your tires or even a tire? I'd guess just about never. Let alone a gas line.

It just doesn't happen that often any more.

It goes back to something I posted earlier in this thread: We all have a set of safety standards that our local health department, fire department, zoning department, plumbing department, and god only knows what ever other local  entity that may have some sense of power over how you build or operate your business.  They write the rules, and you need to be with in those boundaries or rules in order to operate your business. Don't over think the rules just do what they require.

That said I'm far from the get along go along type but if your local health department requires, A,B,C,D, then why would you go to E,F,and G? It's not required so why spend the time money and personal effort to over write the rules?

I can tell you why, because your a good guy and want to do the right thing, and that is good but don't try to out think the pros you'll only cause yourself problems, and grief.

Speaking of over thinking your almost done and soon the ultimate worry will come: I built it"Oh hell will they show up, will I be able to handle it, is my food that good, what happens if?  Those worries are on the way.

Good Luck my Friend
post edited by Dr of BBQ - 2010/03/14 00:16:37
localnet
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 08:35:45 (permalink)
I would not run a gas line under the trailer.

I ran the road for twenty years, coast to coast and much of Canada. Trust me, there are plenty of things laying out there on the road that could do some serious damage to an undercarriage. And I would say a good number of times I never saw them coming, so no slowing down or quick maneuvering, you just go over it and hope your fuel line on the truck or air lines on the trailer don't get ripped off. 

Hit a road gator, tire casing, just right at highway speed and watch the sparks fly. You can't swerve to good when pulling a trailer, seen many attempts with not so good results, and I am not talking about semi trailers. I would run the lines inside the trailer if possible.

Just my .02

Mike
post edited by localnet - 2010/03/15 08:43:48
Dr of BBQ
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 10:52:48 (permalink)
If you put a gas line inside a trailer it's just another place to collect grease and grime, and an area that is hard to reach and clean. There is no area that is more difficult to clean than the area behind a conduit or gas line. Those are the areas that the health departments look for to spank you when you get inspected

And if under your truck is safe enough for your fuel line  or air lines on the trailer, it's safe enough for a black iron gas line, which is much stronger than a fuel line, or a trailer air hose.

One other thought how many times a year do you hear of someone getting a muffler ripped off their car? On occasion it may happen but not often.

I ran a black iron  propane line under my trailer and have never had a problem, however becuase I ran a 16 foot straight run from one corner to the opposite corner, I wielded a 2 inch angle iron runner under the trailer in 3 foot sections, so that most but not all of the gas line is virtually covered. I did this not for protection but for support. It was easier to tack the angle in 4 or 5 places than do a bunch of brackets to attach the gas line.


chefbuba
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 11:35:14 (permalink)
My gas line runs under the trailer....Also catering trucks for 6 years with 2, 50gal propane tanks under...... Never blew up!
localnet
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 13:43:09 (permalink)
Just mt .02...

And, this is not my industry, and I have allot to learn.

But I know what it is like to have the bejesus ripped out from under a tractor and trailer, not fun and not in the least bit cheap to fix. Been there and done that.

Mike
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 18:09:05 (permalink)
Our RV has all the LP lines running under the floor (from factory).  Well tied down black iron pipe is "code" for RVs.  You can use GASTITE brand hoses to connect from pipe to appliance.  Be very careful on your flex hoses.  We bought a metal LP gas flex hose for water heaters that did not hold up to the vibration of traveling down the road.  Since we shut our LP off while under way, we found the leak when we turned the LP back on. 



While this is from the NFPA 1192 Standard on Recreational Vehicles, it probably applies to most if not all trailers including food trailers. (Section 2-4 Fuel Gas Piping Systems)

2-4.2 (a) Gas pipe shall be steel or wrought-iron pipe complying with ASTM A53 Specifications for Pipe, Steel, Black and Hot-Dipped, Zinc-Coated Welded and Seamless. Threaded copper or brass pipe in iron pipe sizes shall be permitted to be used.

2-4.8 Routing and Protection of Tubing. Tubing shall not be run inside walls, floors, partitions, or roof except that 1/4 inch O.D. tubing shall be permitted to be concealed provided it is enclosed with a metallic covering of thickness equivalent to the thickness equivalent to the thickness of the tubing enclosed. Where tubing passes through walls, floors, partitions, roofs, or similar installations, such tubing shall be protected by the use of weather-resistant grommets that shall fit snugly both the tubing and the hole through which the tubing passes. tubing shall be routed to be protected from physical damage, sharp edges, and moving parts.
localnet
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 18:37:39 (permalink)
See, learn something new everyday! Thanks for the info.

Mike
localnet
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 18:44:03 (permalink)
And now I have a question regarding fire safety and Ansul systems. Who is permitted to install these systems? I am looking at $2200 for such a system installed for a 4' exhaust hood. I can pick up a like new unit on CraigsList, with a 6' hood for $625? Is there some mystery here for some nipple, fire bottle, switch box and nozzles? What gives? Is this something I could do with the right tools and pass muster on inspection? or do I need an authorized installer? What do you think? The wife says let em do it for the money, because she is worried regarding insurance. Help me out.

Mike
THE WILD DOG
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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 18:52:19 (permalink)
Just out of curiosity, can't I just connect a regular propane hose to the gas pipe ? Does it have to be flex ?  I would think that the rubber would be more flexible than metal.

Also I am going to purchase the pipes tomorrow... I'm excited now since that is the real last step of the build.

I trimmed out everything today and couldn't figure out a way to screw the countertops down from underneath so I just removed the FRP and screwed it down from the top :-)


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Re:Mobile kitchen build info 2010/03/15 20:04:48 (permalink)
At the front of my trailer I ran hose to my propane heater from the black iron pipe. In the back, (didn't do both at the same time) I ran my BI line through the floor and put a flex line on my char broiler and just this year ran a hose to another propane heater. But that's Illinois, and we get one fire department inspection and that's it.

If you don't think the fire department is going to cry foul go for it. But I'd check local regs if you can find them online.

Jack
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