Range and griddle question

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cajam124
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2013/11/09 10:39:20 (permalink)

Range and griddle question

Hi folks,
With the cooking equipment and hood up against the wall, what did you guys use to build out the wall so it would pass inspection for fire safety?
So far, I've got 2x4 studs 16" apart with R13 roll insulation --all overlaid with 1/2" plywood.
Thanks in advance!
#1

14 Replies Related Threads

    Midnights
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 10:47:41 (permalink)
    Have you asked your Health Dept. this question first? They should be your first stop in such code-related questions. Tell us what they said, and we might be able to give some insight into how to implement it.
    #2
    Michael Hoffman
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 11:52:09 (permalink)
    Perhaps the question should be posed to the fire department rather than the health department.
    #3
    Midnights
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 12:22:41 (permalink)
    Perhaps. In my city, that build stuff is under the Health Dept. and only the fire suppression system and extinguishers are under the Fire Dept. Inspection. Either way, asking here isn't going to give him the answers that will help him pass.
    #4
    fishscale28
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 17:34:41 (permalink)
    Not true he can get answers!

    According to the NFPA (which is the governing source of all this) there has to be a certain amount of clearance between open flame appliances and any combustibles. Depends on several things but wood behind the line would be a no no unless your equipment is spaced far enough away with a thick enough piece of stainless in between. I would ditch the wood, add in aluminum square tubing for studs, insulates with fire proof insulation, cover with Duroc (concrete board) then do your stainless. You're then setup for zero clearance-which keeps fire Marshall bill happy!
    #5
    Midnights
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 17:51:41 (permalink)
    While NFPA may make guidelines which municipalities may use (and many do), saying they actually govern is not correct. Local municipalities are the only ones with the power to say definitively what is allowed within their own municipality in regards to building codes of this manner.
    #6
    nightmarejr
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 18:21:54 (permalink)
    From my understanding the 2x4 is fine for frame. Ideally you should be going with metal studs or if you can weld build a thinner frame using square tubing.  For the actual wall you need to use a cement board which is also known as a hardibacker. Then you can put your flashing and what not over it. But be careful with the wood you use. 

     

    Local food truck that got on fire. probably because they had wood turn into charcoal over an extended period. So avoid woods near heat. 
    post edited by nightmarejr - 2013/11/10 00:23:08
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    fishscale28
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/09 23:38:02 (permalink)
    With all do respect I think that's totally inaccurate.  While some jurisdictions may deviate slightly on certain things the NATIONAL FIRE PROTECTION ASSOCIATION does set forth the rules and guidelines used by Fire Marshalls in cities, states, counties, parishes and districts across our NATION.  Just as the NEC outlines codes for electricity codes and regulations.  True-they NFPA may not be the ones actually governing the rules-but they are the ones that make the rules.  For municipalities to enforce.  Local municipalities aren't likely to develop their own sets of rules for stuff like this as these are national codes and guidelines developed for tons of applications.  They might be more strict-but NFPA is a great place to start.
     
    And wooden 2X4's without the proper clearance are a no no.  No ifs, ands or buts.  They're combustable materials.  The area behind cooking equipment gets very, very hot and with enough sustained heat they can certainly ignite.  If following the proper guidelines with enough clearance and the right materials (I think 3" is allowed for 22 guage steel covered walls) then you'll be fine.  But that 3" might be a pretty tough amount of space to cough up in such a narrow kitchen.  In reality would it be a big deal?  Probably not...anything to worry about?  Nope-I wouldn't.  BUT it would be proper code (using wood, that is).
     
    Midnights

    While NFPA may make guidelines which municipalities may use (and many do), saying they actually govern is not correct. Local municipalities are the only ones with the power to say definitively what is allowed within their own municipality in regards to building codes of this manner.

     
     
    #8
    Dr of BBQ
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    Re:Range and griddle question 2013/11/10 11:31:47 (permalink)
    fishscale28 With all do respect I think that's totally inaccurate.  While some jurisdictions may deviate slightly on certain things the NATIONAL FIRE PROTECTION ASSOCIATION does set forth the rules and guidelines used by Fire Marshalls in cities, states, counties, parishes and districts across our NATION.  Just as the NEC outlines codes for electricity codes and regulations.  True-they NFPA may not be the ones actually governing the rules-but they are the ones that make the rules.  For municipalities to enforce.  Local municipalities aren't likely to develop their own sets of rules for stuff like this as these are national codes and guidelines developed for tons of applications.  They might be more strict-but NFPA is a great place to start.

    And wooden 2X4's without the proper clearance are a no no.  No ifs, ands or buts.  They're combustable materials.  The area behind cooking equipment gets very, very hot and with enough sustained heat they can certainly ignite.  If following the proper guidelines with enough clearance and the right materials (I think 3" is allowed for 22 guage steel covered walls) then you'll be fine.  But that 3" might be a pretty tough amount of space to cough up in such a narrow kitchen.  In reality would it be a big deal?  Probably not...anything to worry about?  Nope-I wouldn't.  BUT it would be proper code (using wood, that is).

    Midnights

    While NFPA may make guidelines which municipalities may use (and many do), saying they actually govern is not correct. Local municipalities are the only ones with the power to say definitively what is allowed within their own municipality in regards to building codes of this manner.

     
    Sorry but Midnights is right on target. Local fire departments  may or may not adopt the NFPA code. But it must be adopted to become local law,usually by the city counsel, or mayor.
     
    The local Fire Department's wrote their own codes for years, long before there even was a NFPA. And it's the same with plumbing and electrical codes.
     
    Our local plumbing inspector tried that national code crap on my first build but I had read very carefully our local codes and had a copy in hand. I explained what he requested I do wasn't our city code and he admitted I was correct. But then added "but we like to see the national codes followed", but admitted it was not necessary. So check with your local authorities and get a copy of the local city or county code and read and follow it. Nothing more is expected nor can they require anything else.
    #9
    cajam124
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    Thank you all! 2013/11/10 11:41:28 (permalink)
    Thank you all for your feedback!  As a registered nurse who can't take it anymore (at age 57), I am sooooo looking forward to doing something I love to do: cook.  Ironically, I'm shifting focus from one end of the body -- to the other; (basically...output to input).
    Thank you all again!
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    fishscale28
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    Re:Thank you all! 2013/11/10 13:51:38 (permalink)
    I have helped build or been a part of builds in restaurants in Tennessee, Florida, North Carolina, Georgia, Louisiana, Texas and Louisiana.  Yes-many jurisdictions make up their own rules and regulations but the NFPA is the foundation and is referenced in many different forms and fashions throughout local codes and regulations.  And not to mention are a great way to look and see what a good starting point would be.  And when hoods are made and certified their made to the NFPA codes...not the local codes and regulations of each and every jurisdiction throughout the country.
     
    YMMV.  But regardless the NFPA outlines and sets forth a lot of the rules and regulations used by all sorts of jurisdictions.  And yes-you're all correct-its up the the local jurisdictions to develop, enforce and maintain their codes and regulations.  My only point was using the NFPA as a guideline/starting point would be a good idea.  And again-yes you are correct in that the only definitive answer would be had by your local inspector.  (Also realize following NFPA would also give you a bit of an umbrella if you happened to visit other jurisdictions-as it is accepted on my levels).
    #11
    BelCibo
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    Re:Thank you all! 2013/11/10 23:44:21 (permalink)
    Our back wall is stainless against aluminum u channel riveted to the walls.  The flat top is 2 inches form the wall and while I have not temperature checked the stainless it gets so hot you can't touch it.  Glad there's no wood back there.
     
    If I did it over I would put some type of sound dampener between the stainless and studs, it vibrates like crazy driving down the road.
    #12
    cajam124
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    Re:Thank you all! 2013/11/11 16:49:25 (permalink)
    Well, thanks to you all, I figured out what I'm going to do:
    behind the line of cooking equipment only: replace my 2X4 wood studs with rectangular aluminum lengths; then overlay it with 22g SS.  I just need to find out if there is such a thing as fire-rated insulating material for between the aluminum studs. Does that sound proper?
    Thanks.
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    Rcoy
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    Re:Thank you all! 2013/11/11 20:20:11 (permalink)
    Sounds pretty good to me, mineral wool is a fireblock type of insulation you may want to consider. As others have posted, it would be good to check code before spending a bunch of money and time.
    #14
    fishscale28
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    Re:Thank you all! 2013/11/11 20:26:47 (permalink)
    Mineral wool is perfect-that's what I used for insulation behind the line and it worked great...with some hardi backer/duroc behind the stainless...worked out well and meets/exceeds codes from whoever you're looking to satisfy!
     
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