Realty question

While browsing properties i came across a house that i'm familiar with. A gruesome murder took place in the kitchen there a couple years ago. Does the seller and realtor "have" to disclose this info to prospective buyer? I would think so for legal reasons but i'm unsure.

Some state have the legal requirement that if the place was the location of a violent crime that has to be disclosed to the prospective buyer. If it is an issue to the buyer I think they should do their homework and google it or make it part of the title search.

When we sold Janet's Father's home after he passed away in 2001 (heart failure death at home), the realtor told us that we would have to disclose the death to the buyer before the closing. She did that and apparently it didn't affect the sale. I am not sure if it was a legal requirement (California) or the realtor's way of controlling the deal.

quote:

Originally posted by jeepguy

While browsing properties i came across a house that i'm familiar with. A gruesome murder took place in the kitchen there a couple years ago. Does the seller and realtor "have" to disclose this info to prospective buyer? I would think so for legal reasons but i'm unsure.

Depends on what state you are in. In Arizona, the answer is no, the seller and broker are not required to disclose this information.

I used to own a 125+ year old farmhouse in rural NE Indiana. After purchasing it I found out that over the years no less than 6 people had passed away inside the house at various times from various causes ( one shotgun suicide ). Nobody told me a thing before buying the place.

Never saw any ghosts, so no problem.

We just had a whole family tortured and killed in Fishkill NY. Mother ,Father, 3 kids. About three weeks after the crime, the house was torn down. Just a pile of rubble now. Don't know if it will be re-built.
Mike

quote:

Originally posted by jeepguy

While browsing properties i came across a house that i'm familiar with. A gruesome murder took place in the kitchen there a couple years ago. Does the seller and realtor "have" to disclose this info to prospective buyer? I would think so for legal reasons but i'm unsure.

Who cares?
Do you like the house, and wanna buy it?
I could care less what happened in a house that I really liked.
Whats the problem?

Here in California I was told it must be disclosed if it is within 3 years.

What's the problem? Try talking to the next-door neighbors at Spahn Ranch about the kind of people that wander onto their property. I don't want the "Grey line Tours" hearse stoppingin front of my house twice a day.

In some cases it might be a rationale for a selling price increase...think an investment in a future 'crime museum' (if the fame of the case were to expand). Perhaps the OJ case might be an example. However some might be a bit upset if they did a remodeling job a year or two down the road and found a Charlie Manson paint/blood smear or two under the wallpaper.

As Elise says. If the house was a major crime scene, perhaps some of the former criminal associates might return to search for the missing...stash/weapons/cash/etc. I would want to know the particulars if I were investing a lot in the place.

Wow! that's a good one. In Mass. you have to disclose material defective conditions you know about if asked (i.e. it's okay to say the house is in good condition, but if someone asks if there's termite damage you have to report what you know). I don't know if anyone's ever argued that a death materially effects the value of their home. Given the age of much of our housing stock, that would rule out the sale of about half the houses in the state.

I sure didn't have any recourse when it turned out that the apartment I rented in NYC had been occupied by prostitutes. Interesting late-night visitors, needless to say.

When I was a kid, it was pretty common for the locals in Maine to make up stories about various stains and such in an old house to get the city folk intrigued. There was a similar situation when my Wife's family sold the 100+ year family residence in Idaho. Purchasers were planning on making it a B&B for the Sun Valley crowd and pumped the family for scandals they could use in their brochure. When there weren't any, they made up a story that the place was a notorious Wild-West bordello.

Each state is different on disclosure.

In Indiana Disclosure is "mandatory" if the seller is aware of what needs to be disclosed.

So in a perfect example:

If someone axe murdered their family in 1875 the fact should have been relayed on to every owner since, however the loophole is when did the full disclosure law go into effect and what has to be disclosed.

Yeah, I was specifically thinking about the LaBianca house, which is a block away from my friend's house. At one point, a rock singer owned it, probably for its scandalous histort. The current owners have built a small front house, since the original house was set far back on the property, so the view is now blocked.

I believe it is don't ask, don't tell. If you don't ask, they do not have to disclose that information.

When I was house hunting, I could feel "presences" of the deceased. I've also seen a ghost and feel "portals" to other places, i.e., cold air pockets, etc. Anyway, sorry to get off on another subject. Maybe I'll start a thread near Halloween on the stuff.

From a different prospective, personally I would always divulge every thing I know about what I sell no matter what it is. That way I can always be at peace with myself.

Paul E. Smith
Knoxville, TN

I think that the whole "Amityville Horror" thingy changed the policy/law. Don't ever build your home on a "sacred" burial ground.

I think it's all a bunch of crap. I live in an apartment building that was a boarding house, built in 1870. I'm sure people have died here. Hell, people die at home all the time.

If a particularly heinous murder occurs in a certain place, it can drive down the value of the home. But why? Now, Elise's example of the Manson murders may be different, only because it becomes a tourist destination.

But with the Amityville thingy, do you really believe there is blood seeping from the walls? Yeah, and Poltergeist is real.

I guess people believe what they want to.

How can you disclose every person who has ever died in any home? If you believe in ghosts, does a person have to die at home for their spirit still to haunt it?

I just remembered a great Simpsons episode about this very subject. Marge was a real estate agent, and sold a famous mass-murder site to the Flanders without disclosing the info. She drove up to finally tell them, and found the whole family on the floor in pools of blood. She screamed, and Ned woke up and said, "Oh, we were just eating BBQ and got so tired we decided to all take a nap right here on the floor."

If I recall, the Amityville family admitted the story was a hoax they came up with while drinking some wine to increase interest in the house they wanted to unload.

HotDogHead - we felt a strange presence when we did our home inspection, too. Turned out to be the current owner who was hiding in the third bedroom. I introduced myself and shook his hand and he immediately ran to the bathroom to wash his hands! Very spooky!!!

We exorcised the house with a lot of clorox clean-up and fresh paint, and other than the occasional disappointed process-server we've had no further incidents.

Such disclosure laws are silly.
Maybe for people consumed with things like the idea that buildings are haunted, thinks their lives are being affected by spirits (no, not the liquid kind), reveres saintly images in burnt tortillas and water-damaged ceiling panels, and believes and/or pays for psychics etc, it could be a purchase issue ... but hey, that's what ghostbusters are for.

My house is an 1892 and for a 70 year period starting early in the last century has periodically been a multi family rental. How many people have lived in my house since it was built ... died in the house ... crimes? ... I have no idea.

The home two houses down from mine was built in the 1840's. Where I used to live there was a house about 1/3 mile away that was built in the 1790's.
It seems pretty tenuous to make a legal issue out of deaths in a structure.

More ridiculous laws ... but who are we to question the LAW right??

quote:

Originally posted by EliseT

Here in California I was told it must be disclosed if it is within 3 years.

What's the problem? Try talking to the next-door neighbors at Spahn Ranch about the kind of people that wander onto their property. I don't want the "Grey line Tours" hearse stoppingin front of my house twice a day.

California has a 3 year mandatory disclosure rule for all deaths in a house, except if the death was due to AIDS. Then the seller can only disclose it if specifically asked, and only for a 1 year period.

In my boyfriend's old house, the former owners had a son who had Marfan's Syndrome and shot himself in one of the bedrooms. I never really felt creepy or anything. Occasionally, the former owner, the father, would show up in their yard, grief-stricken. They'd have to gently ask him to leave.

And my parent's house is over 100 years old, dating back to the time when bodies were laid out in the house for the wake, so I'm sure people have died and been kept there. I've never felt anything creepy there, either. I believe that if the soul goes peacefully, they don't linger in the house.

Just imagine how crowded it would be if everyone turned into ghosts and hung around!

State law, different state, different law. I once owned a house where eighteen or twenty members of a motorcycle gang had been murdered. Good property and a nice resale a few years later. I told the buyers about the slaughter and they seemed pleased...never try to figure people out...they will always surprise you.

I wasn't even thinking "ghosts" or any of that. More so that i'd be bummed if all my new neighbors told me after i moved in. Anyway the house is a dump, and at 460k they'll have a hard time getting rid of it.