Speaking of tipping

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drsmoke02
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2006/03/13 15:00:24 (permalink)

Speaking of tipping

When you go to a restaurant and order an expensive bottle of wine,do you include that in the tip calculation,or just the food and adjust for the wine...I always include the wine,however alot of people don't.What say you.
#1

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    Greymo
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/13 15:39:17 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by drsmoke02

    When you go to a restaurant and order an expensive bottle of wine,do you include that in the tip calculation,or just the food and adjust for the wine...I always include the wine,however alot of people don't.What say you.


    We always tip the same for wine as for food.........he has to open bottle, pour wine, ice it (if white) and return to table to pour more. Actually, it is just as much work as serving the meal.
    #2
    Scorereader
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/13 17:19:52 (permalink)
    I tip on the entire bill.
    The mistake I usually make is calculating from the total, instead of the sub total (pre-tax).

    For example. Let's say my dinner sub-total was $60. Tax in DC is 10%, so that's $66 total.

    20% of $60 is $12. So, if I tip 20% of the food, drink total, pre-tax, the total with tax and tip is $78.

    if I tip %20 of the total (after tax), that's a tip $13.20 tip, which is actually a 22% tip (of the sub-total) with a total cost of 79.20, which invariable I'd round up to $80, which is adding a very high 1/3 to my original $60 sub-total.

    And tipping 20% of the sub-total is normal for me, and almost expected at decent restaurants.
    At times, if service doesn't meet my 20% expectations, I'll tip 15% of the total (after tax), which on a $66 total ($60 subtotal), ends up to be $9.90 and I'll round up to $10. Which is still more than a 15% tip of the sub-total, so I'm still tipping well, even for lackluster service. Which is usally when my wife points out that I overtipped for the service we got.

    I hope that wasn't too confusing.
    #3
    BT
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/13 18:28:40 (permalink)
    I usually tip about 20% on the entire bill, but I do not obsess about these things. The calculation is a rough one, done quickly in my head (you know--double the bill, move the decimal point) and typically I round off so that the total cost, with tip, is a round dollar amount (or at least doesn't involve small change). And once again, I ALWAYS leave the tip in cash, even if I pay the bill with a credit or debit card.
    #4
    lleechef
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/13 19:10:37 (permalink)
    Being in the business, I always overtip on the entire bill. Of course in our town we only go to our favorite places, where we know the chef and the wait staff. I generally tip 20-25%. At the sushi bar, it's more because the chef doesn't charge us for everything!
    #5
    Mosca
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/13 19:31:18 (permalink)
    I do the same thing as BT. Double the bottom line and round up to the next dollar, always in cash.


    Tom
    #6
    mr chips
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 00:28:29 (permalink)
    20% unless the service is awful. I live in a state with no sales tax so it is fairly easy.
    #7
    felix4067
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 00:32:40 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by BT

    I usually tip about 20% on the entire bill, but I do not obsess about these things. The calculation is a rough one, done quickly in my head (you know--double the bill, move the decimal point) and typically I round off so that the total cost, with tip, is a round dollar amount (or at least doesn't involve small change). And once again, I ALWAYS leave the tip in cash, even if I pay the bill with a credit or debit card.

    Exactly. Although sometimes I have no choice but to tip on the card, I do try to avoid it, especially in places I frequent.

    At this point, I'm trying to figure out why on earth someone wouldn't include their wine (or any other drinks) in what they tip on...I don't get it. Unless you brought it yourself, it's part of the service (and even if you brought it yourself, the server usually uncorks and pours it).
    #8
    stevencarry
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 00:42:24 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by mr chips

    20% unless the service is awful. I live in a state with no sales tax so it is fairly easy.

    I keep thinking when the "service is awful" I don't blame the server even though that's who I stiff, I blame management for not having someone in charge of overseeing service. (No one running the show)
    These non-performers would not be if someone was keeping them in line.
    One time; I quess we were looking awful unhappy because a manager came over and said "I'm sorry, is something wrong?" I said well yes we got entrees before appetizers and now we get the check, where is the dessert we ordered ? A big apology and free dessert and I'll bet other adjustments were made that day.
    #9
    porkbeaks
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 07:37:20 (permalink)
    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb
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    Jimeats
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 09:12:25 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb
    Cost of living? Chow Jim
    #11
    porkbeaks
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 09:37:19 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by Jimeats

    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb
    Cost of living? Chow Jim


    But the waitstaff is already getting more based on the increased cost of food/drink over that time. I don't see how that should result in the customer being expected to cough up an additional 5%. pb
    #12
    tmiles
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 10:24:34 (permalink)
    Like BT, I do a quick figure, and then go up or down depending on the experience. I include the booze. If I get a side order of fries, I tip on that too.
    #13
    Mosca
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 11:11:03 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb



    I think you should do what you think is best. My rationale is that the difference between 15% and 20% for most of the places I go to is on the order of a couple bucks, so I feel I can make a difference in someone's day for a little bit more than pocket change. And if it's a place I go to often, then I become known as a more desireable customer.

    I do think that a lot of servers would accept a steady 15%, rather then 20% here, 3% there. If that's what you do, and you think it's right, then continue and don't look back.


    Tom
    #14
    drsmoke02
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/14 15:42:35 (permalink)
    Bill Murry ate in my place,he left $50.00 tip on a $25.00 tab,my waitress got a thrill of a lifetime.
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    felix4067
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/15 03:21:52 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    quote:
    Originally posted by Jimeats

    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb
    Cost of living? Chow Jim


    But the waitstaff is already getting more based on the increased cost of food/drink over that time. I don't see how that should result in the customer being expected to cough up an additional 5%. pb

    The wait staff is NOT getting more based on the increased cost of food/drink, they are simply being charged more for the assumption of tips based on their total food/beverage sales. They are still making the same sub-minimum wage they've been making since the last increase in 1997 ($2.13 per hour by US Federal law).
    #16
    Scorereader
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/15 11:10:06 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by felix4067

    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    quote:
    Originally posted by Jimeats

    quote:
    Originally posted by porkbeaks

    Can someone remind me why an adequate tip is now 20% where 15% used to be acceptable? pb
    Cost of living? Chow Jim


    But the waitstaff is already getting more based on the increased cost of food/drink over that time. I don't see how that should result in the customer being expected to cough up an additional 5%. pb

    The wait staff is NOT getting more based on the increased cost of food/drink, they are simply being charged more for the assumption of tips based on their total food/beverage sales. They are still making the same sub-minimum wage they've been making since the last increase in 1997 ($2.13 per hour by US Federal law).


    I think pb's point, which is valid, is that the tip is larger because the food cost to the consumer is higher. If a meal that used to cost $10, is now $13, then the tip is going to be larger. So, why is 15% no longer the standard? It seems to be a logical question.
    My wife feels the same way. 15% used to be a standard tip for good service. You might give 18% or as high as 20% for outstanding service. Now, many people consider 15% to be a low tip and 18% or 20% standard. I almost feel it's expected, and I end up tipping in that higher range. Which means I end up giving 15% for less than good service, which usually upsets my wife, who remembers getting poor tips from people when her service was excellent, but the food wasn't prepared to the liking of the customer. The cooks didn't get screwed out of money, but my wife did.





    #17
    felix4067
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/15 12:24:06 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by Scorereader
    I think pb's point, which is valid, is that the tip is larger because the food cost to the consumer is higher. If a meal that used to cost $10, is now $13, then the tip is going to be larger. So, why is 15% no longer the standard? It seems to be a logical question.
    My wife feels the same way. 15% used to be a standard tip for good service. You might give 18% or as high as 20% for outstanding service. Now, many people consider 15% to be a low tip and 18% or 20% standard. I almost feel it's expected, and I end up tipping in that higher range. Which means I end up giving 15% for less than good service, which usually upsets my wife, who remembers getting poor tips from people when her service was excellent, but the food wasn't prepared to the liking of the customer. The cooks didn't get screwed out of money, but my wife did.

    I see...I didn't think of it that way.

    Personally, I started tipping 20% because the math is easier. Also, I feel like a schmuck leaving only a buck-fifty on a ten-dollar tab...I consider all the work my server has to do for me, and how much they make an hour compared to what I do, and sometimes it comes out to 30% or more. For bad service, I will leave a single dollar, or a single quarter (depending on how bad the service was) regardless of the total bill.

    On further thought...the increase from 15% to 18-20% can be seen as a (very low) cost-of-living increase. What with the minimum wage having stayed the same for the last nine years, something has to change if we expect them to live and pay their bills.
    #18
    porkbeaks
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/15 12:27:14 (permalink)
    Another thing that has always rankled me about the system of tipping in restaurants is the fact that it's based on the dollar total of the bill. In most every other instance where a tip is considered to be "customary", it's based on the service rendered. Parking valets, hair stylists, red caps (if they still exist), bell hops, the tip is a set amount. The guy with a Yugo isn't expected to tip more than a guy driving a Lincoln and does the bellhop deserve more because the guest is traveling with expensive luggage?. They may hope for a bigger tip, but it isn't mandated like it is for waitstaff who, after all, are only providing the service of order taking and food delivery. Why in the world should the gratuity for that service be so affected by what you order? Why should I be expected to leave an extra $20 because I decided to splurge on a bottle of Dom instead of staying with a much less expensive domestic? Does the server expend more energy to bring me a $50 prime steak dinner than he would have had I ordered a pasta dish?

    Before anyone accuses me of being a cheapass, I have to tell you that I am and have always been a good tipper. My sister was a waitress starting in a greasy-spoon diner, worked her way up to the Ryland Inn in Whitehouse, N.J. (where dinner for 2 these days can run you well over $500), and ended up as the hostess at the Clinton House (Clinton, N.J.). Through the years, she educated me to the why's and wherefore's of the plight of waitstaff. For the past 40 years, I've left 15% when service was adequate, 20% (or more) when I felt it was deserved, and anywhere from 10% down to a nickle when things had really gone downhill. At Galatoire's in New Orleans in the early 80's, I left a dollar after a lunch for two during which the waiter had me so pissed off I came close to wringing his neck.

    I guess there is no solution to this issue other than to pay the waitstaff a decent wage and raise menu prices accordingly. Until that happens, don't expect me to feel obligated to leave a 20% tip for only adequate service...pb
    #19
    roossy90
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/17 17:36:47 (permalink)
    I am not even going to put my whole feelings into this, as it has been discussed too many times. With much ado--But I tip on the bottom line...
    Tax and all...
    I include everything I have consumed during the meal that I have been charged for, and if something was "grat/comp'ed".. then I tip as if it was still on the bill, unlike people who come in with a coupon and get one meal free, they tip on the total on the check when they should be tipping before the meal was taken off.
    They know how to add...
    Enough said.
    #20
    John A
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/18 18:35:41 (permalink)
    Years ago I was the GM for a company that provided curbside baggage check in service at our airport. Very early one morning, while standing behind one of our skycaps (Without his knowledge) I overheard the following, "Passenger, am I supposed to tip you, Skycap – Only if you want your bags to get to the same place as you”.

    John
    #21
    Sundancer7
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/18 19:28:45 (permalink)
    Originally posted by John A

    Years ago I was the GM for a company that provided curbside baggage check in service at our airport. Very early one morning, while standing behind one of our skycaps (Without his knowledge) I overheard the following, "Passenger, am I supposed to tip you, Skycap – Only if you want your bags to get to the same place as you”.

    John

    John, I wish tipping made a difference on whether your bags got there or not. Most of the time, the bags will show up but I have had numerous experiences where the bags did not arrive with me. They show up on the next flight or the one after that.

    That presents major problems if you are in a meeting or have presentations. I always tip the guy at curbside around $5.00. Sometimes my bag got there and sometimes they did not. Unfortunately it gets out of their hands pretty soon and you are at the mercy of many other factors.

    A few flights ago, my bags did not make it until two days later. They had gone to Paris, France. I know that because of two factors. 1: Delta told me and 2: had Paris, France main airport sticker on my bags. I had tipped $5.00 that time.

    I have began to use ComAir almost all the time and I do a planeside check and then I pick my bags up immediately after I get off the plane and I have them with me all the time. It is much more combersome that way but it works for me.

    Paul E. Smith
    Knoxville, TN
    #22
    seafarer john
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/18 21:08:50 (permalink)
    In a brief conversation with our waitrress at a local restaurant we learned that she gets her tips in her weekly paycheck ( that is, those paid on a credit card) and has a percentage deducted from her tips for the service fee charged by the credit card company.

    From now on I'm tipping in cash only

    Cheers, John .
    #23
    roossy90
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/18 23:18:32 (permalink)
    quote:
    Originally posted by seafarer john

    In a brief conversation with our waitrress at a local restaurant we learned that she gets her tips in her weekly paycheck ( that is, those paid on a credit card) and has a percentage deducted from her tips for the service fee charged by the credit card company.

    From now on I'm tipping in cash only

    Cheers, John .

    I have had that deducted from several different employers. When we did our cash out at the end of shift, there is a line showing how much was deducted for the CC transaction. It bothered me in the sense that "why penalize the server for allowing customers to use their credit cards at the restaurant?"..
    Still fazes me how cheap some owners are. I mean it is a minor amount to me, andprobably illegal, but it adds up when you factor in all the servers working.
    Still, it isnt right for us to bear the burden of an owner having credit cards..
    I am going to look into the legality of it. I am sure it is, as so many places do take from the servers to cover the cost of a CC transaction.
    I get my CC tips right away, that shift, but I know many places include them in the paycheck.
    It basically sucks....
    #24
    Davydd
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/19 21:25:04 (permalink)
    I tip 20% of the total bill rounded up to the next dollar. So if the tab is $60 and the tax is 10% for a total of $66, I tip $14. That is done in my head rather fast. If it is just drinks at happy hour and a beer is normally $4.00 and the happy hour price is $3.00 the server is going to get a five dollar bill anyway. That's just the way I do it.
    #25
    zataar
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/19 21:36:09 (permalink)
    Davydd, Bless you, my child...
    #26
    dogmeat
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/22 19:45:26 (permalink)
    Tip according to service on the pre-tax total.(especially if there was input,proper service and pouring of the wine)

    Tip in cash - sure, why not. Some people want it on their expense account so they will always use the credit card.

    As an owner we are in fact "fronting" the tip $$$ at the end of the night, sometimes 2-3 days before we see the cc funds hit the bank. Our employees leave nightly with their tips in hand. Cards currently represent 80% of our business, I don't think our employees would benefit from our not taking credit cards. Corporate cards,gift cards,International Cards,Travel Cards, all may carry individual item charges and DIFFERENT RATES which the cheap owner will not find out until 30 days later! What about the people who claim their own relatives didn't have the permession to use the card and the entire bill is charged back? Waitstaff does not participate unless they made a mistake. Probably should be on it's own thread, I'm calming down.

    #27
    tmiles
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/23 10:28:30 (permalink)
    Both of my older daughters have worked in restaurants. The older one has worked in some very good restaurants. Getting a server job in a good restaurant is very hard, and a lot of restaurants need dishwashers and cooks far more than they need servers. I contend that servers make "enough" to make it a job in demand. When a restaurant can't get enough servers, they will find a way to pay them more. Too many servers who complain about "bad tippers", are very cheap when it comes to spreading the wealth themselves. So many servers who think that they deserve a couple of dollars for delivering a small round of drinks, seem to think that a dollar to the dishwasher at the end of the night is cool. As far as credit card fees go, why should the owner eat them??? Can you imagine the cry if a restaurant were to say "no tips to credit cards"? I know that the credit card companies wouldn't allow that, but it gives one pause for thought.

    #28
    V960
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    RE: Speaking of tipping 2006/03/23 17:06:04 (permalink)
    I almost always tip a buck at lunch and 20% any other time. The buck at lunck is a bit over 20%. If I eat Japanese for lunch then it is usually two bucks (to come close to 20%).

    I don't carry cash in the states so paying w/ a card is it.

    As to luggage on flights...there are two kinds...carry on and lost. I never check bags. A Travel Pro 747 will hold all you need for a month on the road (except for France where laundry takes a week to be returned). We should have let the Germans keep the place, except the wine quality would have gone down. At least the trains would be on time, "You are in some hurry Sir?"

    #29
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