Start Up

I had working experience in the restaurant but only as wait staff and never in the kitchen. I know working experience is 180 degree from "owning" a restaurant. However it has been my long dream and passion. I read one post in here about Raine's restaurant and I think the advises from Chef Joe are awesome. I have always known that when I own my place that's how it would be. I am a few years away from the actual execution; however, I am a planner so it doesn't hurt to ask the question now. Please let me know of potential pitfalls in start up. Thank you. Below are my plan.

1. Specialty food
2. Casual but refreshing and immaculate atmosphere. The restroom will be immaculate. I am with "ChefJoe" on that one. I used to work at this place and I had customers told me they have never seen a cleaner restroom (ladies room) and I have always told myself that if I ever own one that's how it would be.
3. Roughly around 12 employees. Full and part-time.
4. Start up cost roughly around 300-400k.
5. My estimate "fix costs" now is around 25-30k/mth. Thus, I need about 180k working capital for the 1st 6mths.

What am I doing now?
1. Develop the recipes and procedures for a SIMPLE MENU. There will probably only be 4 main dishes on the menu with a few variation of each dish. I envision a franchise so I know I need "consistency". To achieve consistency I need procedures.
2. Finalize the "Theme"
3. Ensemble a "perfect plan" with "perfect execution" and ofcourse praying for LUCK.
4. Accumulate working capital.

It is strange but I know many people start out small and then expand; however, I envision the expansion before I even start the first one. I know it sounds ridiculous and naive but I believe that if you do not "Start right, you won't stay right". Also, I know the restaurant business requires long hours so if I own just one and make a decent profit then it is not worth the effort and risk because I would probably make close to the same by continuing to pursue my career.

Please share your experience and inputs. I know many of you have long hours and I sincerely appreciate all your precious time. Thank you.

Howdy 2010--

I'm being brief here--time issues--so forgive the bluntness.

If you're confident in your numbers add 20% to start-up, 25% to working capital. Plus 3%/year between now and your projected opening. Carved in stone? No. But since you're doing projections... .

Think larger on the menu front. Doesn't have to be huge, but unless you're doing super-specialty or planning prix-fixe 4 mains is small, imo, and removes flexibilty (and crimps, rather than helps, food cost issues).

Personal opinion--if you're into the frnachise thing, so be it. I agree that owning multiple establishments is a great way to pad the pockets but there are other options. Of course this depends on your concept. I'm just not into the franchise/corporate thing--I know I'm not you--I'd prefer owning multiple different establishments (a la Wolfgang Puck, e.g.) than franchising. Just a thought.

Working capital can be accumulated more quickly if you form a Subchapter S and sell shares. Just a thought.


Good luck with your plan.

Kevin

"Envisioning a franchise?" If by that you mean starting a concept out of which you can sell franchises, I feel like you're way ahead of yourself. To even think about being a franchisor, you probably need at least a dozen sites. Probably talking six to seven years to get there. Keep your focus: get the first one right.

And I totally agree with Kevin. Four entrees is impractical. You're ruling out a big part of your business. And what is "specialty food?"

Plus, if you've only been a waiter, how are you developing recipes?

Slow down. Doesn't sound to me, and I mean no offense, that you're ready to be thinking big. Think manageable. Get it right the first time. If you tank, you'll have that much more difficulty raising money should you decide to try again.

Good luck in any case.

Thank you for all your warnings. I know what the risks are and I know I have to get started on the first one before taking it further. What I really need are "potential pitfalls" on start up. What are things that each of you successful restaurant owners do in your startup and what are things that you wished you didn't do? What are things that you wish you knew etc.?

Thank you for your warnings on the limited menu. However, let me pose this question to you. How many main items that are really on Pizza Hut or McDonald or Subway? If you have something special and you can make beef, chicken, shrimp and pork, then how many more do you really need? The more items on the menu the harder the quality control the harder to pass on the expertise.

The restaurant that I am discussing here is not something I would have to go to culinary school to develop the recipes. I will adjust my estimates to 25% more on start up cost and 30% more on working capital per Kevin's advises. Thanks again.

quote:

Originally posted by 2010Vision

Thank you for all your warnings. I know what the risks are and I know I have to get started on the first one before taking it further. What I really need are "potential pitfalls" on start up. What are things that each of you successful restaurant owners do in your startup and what are things that you wished you didn't do? What are things that you wish you knew etc.?

Thank you for your warnings on the limited menu. However, let me pose this question to you. How many main items that are really on Pizza Hut or McDonald or Subway? If you have something special and you can make beef, chicken, shrimp and pork, then how many more do you really need? The more items on the menu the harder the quality control the harder to pass on the expertise.

The restaurant that I am discussing here is not something I would have to go to culinary school to develop the recipes. I will adjust my estimates to 25% more on start up cost and 30% more on working capital per Kevin's advises. Thanks again.

Ahhh... But how many years have they experimented to create that menu? Nothing they did overnight to say the least.. Alot of hit and miss test marketing to get were they are... Something you feel in your own heart will be the greatest seller could turn out to be the biggest flop... Always have to be thinking and experimenting!
May take years to come up with the perfect menu, then some trend will come around and destroy it all...

I'm gonna bow out of this thread. You're going to adjust your business plan on the basis of a posting by someone you don't know, just because he said to? (No offense, Kevin. I'm not slamming your expertise or your right to an opinion in any way.)

And you don't have to go to culinary school or be trained to know how to cook? Just exactly what "expertise" are you passing along? Sorry if this sounds harsh, but I've spent my life in kitchens, and really dislike hearing someone assume that he can waltz in and run one like it was a kid's lemonade stand.

As I said, start simple, go slow, and learn your business.

Good luck.

Scallion1,

Thank you for your input. I think I may have miscommunicated here.

First of all, I am not adjusting my "business plan" because Kevin said so . I will simply factoring in the % that he mentioned as part of my calculation and remember he said "it is not carved in stone". I apologize for the wrong choice of words.

Second, I am not assuming I can "waltz" around the kitchen and open a successful restaurant. In any successful restaurant, the Chef is the King. The reason I said the recipes I am developing doesn't require culinary school is because my restaurant will basically come down to 1 or 2 items with a few variations. In other words, how many BBQ, burgers, or pizza joints do you know that the owner has a degree from top culinary school in the country? Because the menu is limited that's why it would be easier to transfer the expertise. A 15 yrs old can easily flip burgers at McDonald in 2 weeks compare to a Chef at a 5 stars restaurant.

With all that said, I apologize if my comments offended you. I know a successful restaurant must have many combination but it must commenced with-great food. Great food requires a great kitchen. So I am not naive to think that I can start something without making sure that I can cook

Again, thank you for all your comments. However, it seems that many of you took my comments as though I have offended you guys and went on the attack. I simply just ask you to share your experience during start up and compare to my note to see whether I miss or hit. I know you guys work long hours and are very successful at what you are doing and again I apologize for sounding like a "dreamer". Please share your start up experience.

Ofcourse, I have my own plan but I am open to suggestions and advises to potential pitfalls for start up. After all, this is the planning and gathering information stage.

I'm certainly not offended. I tend to discourage people from opening places because I've seen so many "can't miss" places go down the tubes. Owned a piece of one myself, to tell the truth.

If you believe in yourself, and in your plan, by all means go for it. As long as you're willing to put in the hours, and can afford to lose the money, and know that the odds on succeeding are very long, go ahead.

And maybe I'm jaundiced because here in NY places open and close in the blink of an eye; the real estate market, leasing or equity, is insane, worse than I've ever seen, and the competition is brutal. Maybe it's easier down where you are. I hope so.

Bon voyage!

Hello 2010,
I agree with everyone's reply, which I think they know, means that this crazy business is a crap shoot. You never know, there's a guy in a top notch building with great ambiance, a wonderful staff, fantastic food, etc., and he can't pay his bills. Across the street is another guy selling hot dogs and hamburgers in a greasy spoon and he drives a new caddy each year. Who knows? Start up money! Who do you owe if it doesn't work? Your talking very serious money here 300 - 400 g's. Like Scallion said, I to try to talk certain people out of opening restaurants, bars, etc., and I also jump on board with someone that I think has a real good shot at it, but again, I'd have to know that person and who they are hooked up with. Why don't you lay it on the line on this site what your 4 items are, price, location, customer base, etc., and maybe between all of us we can help you out. Many years ago, young and wild, I'd always borrow the money from the mob and it worked out great for me because they would send people to my joints and they are great spenders and tippers, so everyone was happy, the only bad side to this was you had to have the money on time, which of course I always did or I wouldn't be here writing to you at this time.
It always comes down to the money, you can have the best food on the planet and a zillion customers, but are you paying the bills? That's the bottom line. If you are paying the bills, then more than likely you are making a buck. Back in the day, in the mid 70's I had a steak joint down at the Jersey shore, cost me 4g's to get it opened and running - Memorial Day until Labor Day open 24 hours a day - Cheese Steaks, Shrimp, Chowder, Snapper Soup, Short Ribs, Breakfast, etc., made so much money that after a couple of years the guy that owned the property would'nt lease it to me, he wanted to do it himself - right down the tubes he went, My food was great - absolutely and as always, but I knew the crowd and the area, back then the bars closed at 3a.m. and you could always come by me and get a drink in a styro cup, beer, cocktail, whatever, made more money on the booze than the food. I know you can't do that today, everyone rats on each other, but back in the day - it was something. Then again, I've had straight by the book joints and starved, like I said - Who knows, it's a crap shoot. This is a good thread, keep it going it should get interesting. One day I was talking to Dickie Betts about being lucky in the things we choose to do in life, he said to me "Success ain't nothing but luck and luck ain't nothing but hard work". Know a few people that became extremely wealthy in this business and a ton of people that lost a lot, let's all see what we can do to help you. Hope you are well. Chef Joe!

2010 I am not offended. No offence to Scallion, but I tend to encourage people to pursue their vision. I have known and seen many fail at a venture, but have known far many more that never tried and the regret weighs on them like a heavy stone.

I do think Scallions challenges are valid as I think my comments are, if only because you are or will be associating with professionals that have been in the business (and possibly with bankers, backers, etc.) who will challenge your idea further. There are certainly many people who own restaurants that do not cook. But they find someone competent that does. There are owners that are not FOH people, but they find someone who is. It is to those people to whom you will have to get your vision across as well (perhaps, if that was an avenue you were to take).

Anyway--you asked about pitfalls. I am sure you are familiar with the (almost proverbial) statement that most restaurants fail because they are undercapitalized. Well, maybe. That's certainly the case often enough. But often it's a lack of captital that they needed becausethey're too busy with--and taking too long fixing--problems that should have been addressed before opening. Staffing; vendors; consistency of product(s)--there needs to be a certain 'confidence' before opening the door. Winging it is just not an option on day one. It's better not to open until these and other issues are addressed. The lack of capital rears its head at the owners who feel forced to open to get money coming in, but have crises dangling around every bend.

Pitfall: Thinking your plan is 'perfect'. Not saying don't have one, just know that there are points--even on day one--that will have to be flexible. Plan for that. Sure, there are some things that you're simply not going to change because the change wouldn't work either. But you have to have an expansive outlook--even if only in secret, to yourself--where you have a sense ahead of time about where flexibilties are possible. This is not something to think about post facto. I remember a guy I ran a supper club for years ago just south of Daytona. I wasn't in on his plan at the outset. I took over a month after he opened. We get through spring and summer well; he's not around that much--good. Come fall business dropped as I expected--he didn't! He had no reserves. We went 6 or 7 weeks with me telling him every day not to spend money. He wouldn't listen. His 'plan' at the beginning was that he could do what he was doing. The club folded before November.

The above are just a couple thoughts.

I'm still saying a limited menu is too limiting.

I also have concerns when you say "so if I own just one and make a decent profit then it is not worth the effort and risk because I would probably make close to the same by continuing to pursue my career."
I immediately think, "Why don't you just buy a franchise?" Not trying to irritate you here. Just being honest. If it's just about the money, buying a franchise is easier. Want to make more? Buy another. You have to really want to be in the restaurant business to have a good shot at success in a your-own-non-franchise establishment. It is consuming. You have to love being consumed like that. I'm sure franchises have their difficulties, but it's simply not the same. I'm just saying, if your eye is to open one place then open more because you could make just as much money in your current career as you would with one, I'm wondering if you should bother with one. It's hard to make the first one successful (let alone think of more) if you don't love it. Just it.

And I'm just challenging you to expand on what you've revealed thus far.

Thank you so much for not being offended by my comments. I will definitely keep this post open.

I think because I haven't been explicit with my plan and that may have led many of you to think that I have no clue what I am saying and I know nothing about the restaurant business. So here is a little about myself.

I left Viet Nam when I was 10 alone and put my life on the line to come here. I worked in the restaurant from busboy to manager since I was 13. I was young and stupid so I dropped out of college and continue to work in the restaurant business and then the post office. Although the post office provided stability and a decent living it always bored me so I went back to school and graduated with a degree in accounting. I am currently a cpa employed with one of the Big 4 as a tax consultant.

Why do I want to start a restaurant with potential of becoming a franchise? Because that's always been my passion. Why do I not going after a made franchise? Because owning my restaurant is my true vision, money is a compliment. Do I know what it is like to work in the restaurant? When I was 13 I worked the entire summer without a day off and doing 12 hours a day.

Here are what I know about restaurants:

1. Mom and Pop.
2. Copy Cats.
3. Theme.

I am not leaving my career to own 1 or 2. Do I know what it takes to run a successful restaurant? Maybe not yet but I know they all comes down to:

1. Great food.
2. Superior services.
3. Luck, luck and luck.

When I look around I see that Italian have chain restaurant such as: Olive Garden (yes I know many of you disagree with that, but hey it is Italian right?), Japanese with "Bennihana", Mexican with "Chili" or "Taco Bell", American with McDonald or Burger King.

So why is it that Vietnamese can't have one on the map?

Since you all are great Chefs and are very successful restaurant owners then you would know exactly the type of Vietnamese food that I want to make into a potential chain (franchise). What do I see in my competition? They are hard working people but they are not from any culinary schools and definitely did not have a degree in finance or accounting. In other words, they never open a restaurant with the same planning that many of you have had. They are either Mom and Pop or Copy Cats type. They are short lasting and cannot expand because they never develop procedures from day one to keep the "consistency". All of these "type" of Vietnamese restaurants are the same everywhere including in Viet Nam. Why they lack the vision that I am having really scared me (I never think I am the first one to think of it, but maybe I am the only one that believe in it strong enough to make it happens) but it is also the challenge that I want to pursue. When I say they are all the same I mean from the restaurant interior to the tables, chairs, silver wares, services, etc. It is frightening that that many Copy Cats can coexist in a small area. Thus, what really separate them from one another? "Food". However, because they lack procedures and because of the "ancient chinese secret" culture they do not pass on the secret of making that awesome dish,they do not last and cannot expand.

Am I having a limited customer base? Maybe and maybe not, because I like to cater to everyone and this type of Vietnamese food is gaining popularity in highly concentrate Vietnamese population. Thus, where do I think my locations will be: Orange County, San Jose, Philadelphia, DC/MD/VA area, Houston and Dallas. Then perhaps Viet Nam. Ofcourse, I need to get one start up first and pray that it will take off before moving to expansion. However, because I am not open a restaurant to primarily "earn a living", I will not settle for Mom and Pop or Copy Cats type like my competition. No, I am not so naive to think that "my competition" is only just the Vietnamese restaurant that serve the "type" of food that I serve, my competition is every restaurants within my location.

Now, I have really put everything in plain view. Please share your start up experience. Again, I am not discourage by negative comments or encourage by the "feel good" comments. I am only after your hard earned experience so that I can learn not to travel down the path of destruction.

Thank you Scallion for "keeping it real" for me. Trust me, I never think it is a "can't miss". All I really want to do is listening to everyone's experience so that I can make sure I am not leaving anything out before I start up.

Thank you Kevin for your "practical" comments. I am an entrepreneur at heart but an accountant by training so I will always maximize expenses and minimize revenues when it comes to estimates.

Thank you Chef Joe. Your comments carried great wisdom. I saw your comments for Rainy's new restaurant and I thought they were awesome. I have seen many of those situations that you describe in your comments here. Once, I knew a guy that was a food supplier to the restaurant I worked. He didn't know crap about restaurant except for delivering food supplies to the restaurants. He put up 300k and open his own. It was a Chinese restaurant in a great location and high population of Chinese and Vietnamese. His place only lasted 1 year because his Chef, which he paid 5k/mth,left. On the other hand, because of my current job I travel extensively around the country and dine at many fine establishments, I saw so many "overhype" places with average food and so so services and yet still in business.

This is how I really feel about it all:

Luck will make you successful but short lasting.
A Well-plan will keep you from disaster. In other words, you can exist without losing your shirt.
No luck, no plan you are going straight to the pit.

I think I said more than enough :). I will sit back and listen to all your great wisdom. Thank you for all your precious time.

quote:

Originally posted by klkruger

2010 I am not offended. No offence to Scallion, but I tend to encourage people to pursue their vision. I have known and seen many fail at a venture, but have known far many more that never tried and the regret weighs on them like a heavy stone.

I do think Scallions challenges are valid as I think my comments are, if only because you are or will be associating with professionals that have been in the business (and possibly with bankers, backers, etc.) who will challenge your idea further. There are certainly many people who own restaurants that do not cook. But they find someone competent that does. There are owners that are not FOH people, but they find someone who is. It is to those people to whom you will have to get your vision across as well (perhaps, if that was an avenue you were to take).

Anyway--you asked about pitfalls. I am sure you are familiar with the (almost proverbial) statement that most restaurants fail because they are undercapitalized. Well, maybe. That's certainly the case often enough. But often it's a lack of captital that they needed becausethey're too busy with--and taking too long fixing--problems that should have been addressed before opening. Staffing; vendors; consistency of product(s)--there needs to be a certain 'confidence' before opening the door. Winging it is just not an option on day one. It's better not to open until these and other issues are addressed. The lack of capital rears its head at the owners who feel forced to open to get money coming in, but have crises dangling around every bend.

Pitfall: Thinking your plan is 'perfect'. Not saying don't have one, just know that there are points--even on day one--that will have to be flexible. Plan for that. Sure, there are some things that you're simply not going to change because the change wouldn't work either. But you have to have an expansive outlook--even if only in secret, to yourself--where you have a sense ahead of time about where flexibilties are possible. This is not something to think about post facto. I remember a guy I ran a supper club for years ago just south of Daytona. I wasn't in on his plan at the outset. I took over a month after he opened. We get through spring and summer well; he's not around that much--good. Come fall business dropped as I expected--he didn't! He had no reserves. We went 6 or 7 weeks with me telling him every day not to spend money. He wouldn't listen. His 'plan' at the beginning was that he could do what he was doing. The club folded before November.

The above are just a couple thoughts.

I'm still saying a limited menu is too limiting.

I also have concerns when you say "so if I own just one and make a decent profit then it is not worth the effort and risk because I would probably make close to the same by continuing to pursue my career."
I immediately think, "Why don't you just buy a franchise?" Not trying to irritate you here. Just being honest. If it's just about the money, buying a franchise is easier. Want to make more? Buy another. You have to really want to be in the restaurant business to have a good shot at success in a your-own-non-franchise establishment. It is consuming. You have to love being consumed like that. I'm sure franchises have their difficulties, but it's simply not the same. I'm just saying, if your eye is to open one place then open more because you could make just as much money in your current career as you would with one, I'm wondering if you should bother with one. It's hard to make the first one successful (let alone think of more) if you don't love it. Just it.

And I'm just challenging you to expand on what you've revealed thus far.

I just opened a Restaurant three weeks ago and we have been jamming.But the help and stock are starting to eat away at the profits.Ive got to get this help under control.I think Ive got about fourteen people on the payroll but they are putting in some long hours.And I have been working 12 hour days six days a week.

You opened a restaurant six weeks ago and you're working 72 hours a week? And getting a day off?

I hope you're overjoyed. That's not a killer schedule for an opening, by any means.

Best of luck.

I found some very good advice on starting up a business at

http://www.entrepreneur.com/

for what it's worth...

2010--

Again, I've only a moment at the moment. Thank you for clarifying your vision; much is clearer to me now. My comments on the franchise stemmed from yours on your reasons for thinking ahead that far in your first post. My comments on the menu being limiting have nothing to do with limiting your clientele. Some restaurants (think sushi-only, or vegetarian, e.g.) limit their clientle by the nature of their cuisine. That's fine. I'm speaking more of limited choice available to the clientele that you do bring in. I suppose I would need more info on what your plan is there--we very well might be on the same page already. I, too, eat all over the country--often Vietnamese--but I cannot think of a Vietnamese restaurant I go to that has a menu I would describe as limited.

Scallion, I thought the same thing. Jellybear, you got it good! Seriously though, take a breath and hone in on what the problems are, now while you can. It is easy(?) to get caught up in the opening rush of energy and by-pass problems in an attempt to keep the buzz going. Be very careful. Opening problems--especially staffing--can soon become near insurmountable. And if they affect your potential return customers negatively it can be hard to recover.

quote:

Originally posted by jellybear

I just opened a Restaurant three weeks ago and we have been jamming.But the help and stock are starting to eat away at the profits.Ive got to get this help under control.I think Ive got about fourteen people on the payroll but they are putting in some long hours.And I have been working 12 hour days six days a week.

Yup, it totally sucks when stock goes down at the end of the week and one needs to re-order... Alot of people, including me, dream of a money tree... But for a resauranter, a stock tree would be awesome!!!
But seriously, food costs up to par there??? Instead of monthly, you may have to go thru the burden of weekly monitoring (make sure food costs are correct, and to make sure one of them 14 employees are not having a weekly feast party on the weekend at your expense...

Why dont you get a hip replaced and go to work the day after you get out of the Hospital then tell me about it.

Look, I'll make it simple. Here's what you gotta know:

a. The walk-in will only break at 9pm on the Friday of Fourth of July weekend.
b. The health inspector will arrive five minutes before you're finally found the time to check the refrigerators, the final rinse temp on the dishwasher and the status of the handsinks and thermometers.
c. As soon as you think you've made some money, something major will break.
d. As soon as you think you've made some money (see "c") you'll remember that you used the withholding and sales tax money to pay for an emergency and never replaced it.
e. Your lead cook will get arrested for, let's say, bigamy, or having lent his van to someone who left half a joint in the ashtray without his knowing about it until he got stopped for having a broken brakelight, or for getting stabbed as an innocent bystander in a scuffle at a bar he stopped in for a quick beer after work. This will only happen on the day that you've had a root canal done. Unless it's on the day of your kid's graduation.
f. You've agreed to cater a party off-premises, the first time you've done this. It's out in the country. Your truck throws a rod halfway there. At this point you discover that the battery in your cell phone is dead.
g. Someone comes in during a rush and insists on having something you don't serve. Remember this phrase, "YOU'RE A RESTAURANT. HOW CAN YOU NOT SERVE ..... (french toast, meatloaf, omelettes at 6pm, iced mochacchinos, sushi). When you hear this, reach for the Louisville slugger you keep under the counter. I recommend a wooden one; the sound of those composite bats bouncing off some moron's head is annoying.
h. You find all the dupes that your cashier has been hiding in the ladies room, in an empty Tampon box, to be able to make her accounting add up at the end of the night when she's skimmed a couple of hundred to pay for a prom dress. After all, you own the business and you're making a ton of money, you'll never miss it and besides you don't pay her enough and anyway you're not a nice man so she deserves something extra for putting up with the fact that you expect her to come to work on time, not chew gum, and have washed her hair that week.
i. One of your counter people, not having been told, assures a customer that there are no peanuts in an entree. He's never thought to check what it's fried in, has he? Call 911 immediately, then call your lawyer.
j. The new building down the street that you thought was going to be a gas station turns out to be - guess what - a restaurant serving the same kind of food you thought was going to be unique to the area. Except that they're serving it in a new $500,000 building, have twice as much parking as you do, and - ta daaaa - a huge advertising budget!!

Go get 'em, 2010.

Just in a goofy mood this morning. Let me say, in spite of all the negative comments I've made, that you're probably way ahead of the curve, because you seem to be intelligent, you've had some experience, you can do the bookkeeping and watch the money, and you're actually thinking and looking for advice and planning.

Give it a shot. Best wishes.

Bill

Scallion has totally summed it all up in one neat package!

FOR SALE one restaurant in Texas.

I think that you have a great idea, Vietnamese food either franchised or in a chain or else family controllled i.e. In and Out Burger. I guess you know of Lee's Sandwiches which are family owned by Vietnamese who started in 1983 in San Jose and now have over 29 locations, they specialize in Banh Mi and they have it down to a science, made to order fresh Banh Mi on rice flour baguettes and they make them fast, the places are absolutley spotless, the employees are well groomed, clean and personable as the Vietnamese are, now their being challenged by Mr. Baguette which is also a Vietnamese family owned chain, success begets competition. Four items though - I guess if it's so outstanding, you'll have a shot and the upside is when you get rolling along and smooth out the wrinkles, it's much easier to add winners to a small menu then a have large menu with a ton of products that you would have to eliminate and alienate some customers who may like the things that you remove. There's a place in California (3 locations) family owned called Killer Shrimp, they sell two items Killer Shrimp and Sweet Potato/Pecan Pie, that's it and of course drinks. They do a great business. A real good plus to all of this is that training employees to make only four things right, is a lot easier than full service. If you can, check out Lee's, they have a website just type in Lee's Sandwiches. Also I understand that a family owned chain from Central America is making a big bang out west with a limited menu - fast food type serving an authentic Spanish type of Chicken. A production assistant who helps me with my cook books, photography and food design, is a Vietnamese girl named Thuy who owns a Vietnamese restaurant in Copenhagen, she does very, very well and the place is small, the food is outstanding. Thinking big like you are doing, got me thinking that many people love Vietnamese food - I know I do, especially Pho and Cha Gio and Com Tom & Thit Nuong with Che Thung - I need a Vietnamese food fix right now. Also, with the Vietnamese population in many large cities in the world, you could possibly down the road put them on your expansion map. I really like this idea, I hope you can pull it off. Okay 2010, - "Dac Biet - Cuoi tuan co phuc vu cae mon dac biet khac', please excuse my deletion of the upper case inflections, they are not on my keyboard - Ha! Good Luck. Chef JOE!

wow, scalloin! you shore got some negativity stored up in that heart of yours. your road must have been very bumpy. hey 2010, you have an awesome idea! i would love to be in on the ground floor of such an adventure. although its not practical for me, i am sure you will find some aspiring young chef to help launch your franchise. we will read about you in forbes some day.... keep dreaming and planning. and... just do it!
i have a mom and pop place in savannah. www.coffeebluffbbq.com
old guys like me can give you great tips from our years of experience.
good luck.

That's not negativity......that's REALITY!! And it ALL happened one hour before the lunch rush. Actually it happened during the Saturday night dinner rush......the cops came in and took away both of my dishwashers (parole violations) and one of my line cooks (we won't even go there).
Do not rely on LUCK.
Do not expect to go on vacation for a long time.
Do not think that a 100-hour work week is unusual.
If you're not pulling in $2 million in sales the second year, you're not making any money (and neither is your help......and that spells MUTINY.)
The customers for the most part are easy but the employees will drive you nuts.
The "breakfast of champions" just became nicotine and caffiene.
Get used to looking in trash barrels to see what the kitchen staff is throwing away.

I can't believe not one person has suggested going to culinary school. How will you know the chef you are about to hire knows his stuff? What will you do when he calls in sick or quits? I understand you have a restaurant background but from what I have read it is all "front of the house". A busy kitchen is a very different world. Don't get me wrong...I don't have a degree either but I have worked under some very talented chefs and always kept my eyes open and my mouth shut. I think you would do your self a favor by just learning the basics of cooking and sanitation at a small cooking school or find some of the better restaurants in your area and apprentice under 3-5 different chefs. You are talking about wagering alot of money. Only one out ten new restaurants make it. Those are not good odds on that kind of money. GOOD LUCK.

Listen to the woman in white! I couldn't have said it better than Ileechef just did. I think I employed the same 2 dishwashers.
People should follow their dreams, but those dreams should include lots of research and most importantly a very healthy dose of reality.

Everyone in the food service industry needs to take a semester in "Murphys Law". I've found that the information in that class has been accurate, actually right down to the wire on the facts!

And Clamshell... Culinary School helps you get a start... But down the road it will come from experience and training that someone thats been in that kitchen for years thats going to be your real teacher! I'm not knocking culinary schools, but alot of Chefs I've met have graduated from the school of hard knocks...

thanks, llee, for picking up my pieces.

note to 2010: spent the entire day today, and expect to spend much of the rest of the week, sorting out the building department and our architect. next week get to deal with fun stuff like arranging for carting, taking the sanitation course (the new place is in a different county), finding out how to take the 25' radio antenna off the roof, making friends with some of the gangbangers who hang out on the corner, writing menu cards and job descriptions, fighting with my insurance broker about the way he's trying to rape us, trying to convince coke bottling to give us some help... and then there's tuesday.

don't get me wrong. i actually love this stuff. and in addition to having opened about 10 restaurants, i grew up in a family that owned a construction company. but the day is never, never long enough, and there's that point when you know that one more cup of tepid coffee and you'll spew it all over the newly-poured kitchen floor. (llee: please don't talk about nicotine. i quit on new year's day, and i'd do some horrible things to be able to have a couple of marlboros every day. but once an addict, always an addict)

i think that what we're telling you is that it's great to dream and plan. but don't waste tons of time and energy. get the first store built, get it built on time and on budget, and get it profitable. then there will be lots of time - or at least some time - to worry about expansion.

one final note: i was the corporate chef for a guy who had the biggest and most influential chain of takeout/gourmet/corporate catering shops in manhattan. i had a 13,000 sq. ft. commissary, including a bakery, to play with. the stores grossed from $20k to $100k per annum, and there were 20 of them. we were rolling in money. but the guy kept on adding and adding. i left, seeing the handwriting on the wall, and two years later the tax vultures came in and padlocked the joints. moral: growth is wonderful and natural. but the doctors have a term for excessively rapid cell growth and it's "cancer". better to have three profitable stores than 15 that are bleeding money. you need to build slowly enough that you can surround yourself with talented, loyal people, and they're a precious commodity.
and stores don't always do what you want them to do. you may think you have it all figured out, and the store takes on a life of its own. what you wanted to sell turns out to be a bunch of dogs, and something that you may have whimsically put on the menu because it had an empty space generates 20% of your sales. so you just never know.

Ok guys. Thank you for all your comments. I truly appreciated your precious time. I know all of you probably are doing an average of 60 hours week with perhaps 1 week vacation a year.

Thanks again Scallion for your comments.
Thank you Llee for your "reality".
Thank you everyone for the culinary tips.
Thank you Bassrocker for your encouragement. Bassrocker, I am in noway labeling the "Mom and Pop" restaurant as a negative thing. I am just pointing out the 3 types of restaurant that I see. When I mentioned what I think about my "competition" cannot expand is not because they are "Mom and Pop" but it is because they are limited because of other circumstances associate with the establishments that they owned. I can be my own boss and make a decent living by just open my own tax office and although not making as much as you guys but would definitely be less stressful.
Thank you Chef Joe for your once again awesome insights. I am glad to hear you believe in my idea but I hope you are not taking it before I start. Just kidding :-). I wish I can keep in touch with you outside.

I am definitely indebt to all of you if someday you guys hear about me. For now, please read my post again. I am asking you guys to share "start up experience" not operational. Running a successful restaurant is not a SCIENCE because if it is everybody would own one. All the comments I have seen so far are "operational". Operational experience are very very helpful but as I said before I have restaurant experience that means I had "operational" experience. I know what it is like in the restaurant. I know we can chat about that forever and we would never get to all the DETAILS. Here are what I think would take to have a restaurant "operate" successfully:

1) Treat your employees like family but never hesitate to disown them if necessary.
2) Treat your customers like they are GODS
3) Worship your policies and procedures like scriptures from the Bible but always flexible like the Yoga goddess
4) Always relax but never content
5) Always reinvest into your business
6) Periodic maintenance is a MUST

Would I say that all the above cover everything? NO, NO, and NO

But as I said before, we will never finish the topic of "operational experience".

Please share your "start up experience". How did you get started? What are your steps before open? What did you do 2 years before, 1 year before, 6mths before, 3 mths before and so on? What did you do that you thought were right? What did you do that you wish you did not do? What are issues that you run into later that you wish you knew before start up?

Remember, I have not own a restaurant yet, so although what you guys said have been AWESOME so far, it would be even better if you guys share your experience so that I can "START ONE UP" first.

Thank you and again I do not take any comments up here as negative or discouraging at all. Please share them all, after all it is good to vent after a long day.

quote:

Originally posted by lleechef

That's not negativity......that's REALITY!! And it ALL happened one hour before the lunch rush. Actually it happened during the Saturday night dinner rush......the cops came in and took away both of my dishwashers (parole violations) and one of my line cooks (we won't even go there).
Do not rely on LUCK.
Do not expect to go on vacation for a long time.
Do not think that a 100-hour work week is unusual.
If you're not pulling in $2 million in sales the second year, you're not making any money (and neither is your help......and that spells MUTINY.)
The customers for the most part are easy but the employees will drive you nuts.
The "breakfast of champions" just became nicotine and caffiene.
Get used to looking in trash barrels to see what the kitchen staff is throwing away.

Yeah, well, at this point I'm outta here like Vladimir.

Sorry you didn't get the info you need. I don't have any more time to spend on this, only to be told "That's not what I want".

Good luck.

oh yea, the topic. you see, its the operaton that captivates our attention now. most of us have no other life at all. and your hours were way off. my place is open 6 days a week and i put in a hundred hours, easy. starting next week, we are dropping to 5 days open, and an 80 hour work week. now thats, a vacation.
three years ago, i was managing a corporate place down in sw fl.
very busy place, lots of crappy people. one day, while surfing the net, i found this place for sale in savannah. it had been closed for years. it was knee high in weeds and spiders. i prayed to god for a way out of my miserable job, and he provided. he opened all the doors in just 2 short months, and we were open. basically, we liquidated all we had, borrowed to the hilt, which we paid off in 12 short months, and are now profiting, but burned out. so...... we are for sale, we want to retire, i guess thats all thats left after burn-out.
peace