Starting a Gyro Stand???

I am very interested in starting a Gyro Stand and have been looking around for some good information/recommendations. I have a good friend out in Colorado that has a Gyro stand in a college town and has been very successful. I also live in a similar area with tons of bars and college students or recent college kids. My idea is to hire some local kids that I find very trustworthy and give them a percentage of the profits every night. My target market is college students and I would likely be operating Wed - Sun, 6 Pm - 3AM. I would catch some families, young professionals leaving work and bars, and the later crowd or bar scene which would by my biggest business.

I have a full time job that I would keep so this would be something where I may work at first but then would find some trustworthy people to do a majority of the work. I know of a few poeple that would be ideal but plan on interviewing many. I live a block away so it would be easy for me to come by fairly often and when needed.

I have two main questions. The first is for any reommendations and advice on the whole process and what I should or shouldn't do. The second is would a hot dog stand be easier/more profitable than a gyro stand.

I greatly appreciate all advice,

Thanks!

Scott
Scotty7254@aol.com

I like the idea. Health code wise it could be an issue if you have the spit going and nothing is keeping the bugs and stuff off of it. And, you need the spit. Meats not nearly as good and crispy without it.

I love gyros! You need to find out if the local Board of Health will allow you to use one of the Gryo Rotating Cone Broilers..Some towns say no! They contend there is too much possibility of bacteria forming. Without that piece of equipment, you are saddled with pre-sliced cryovac gyro strips that must be heated on a griddle..they are terrible IMHO.

I'm purely guessing, but I have to believe there are more takers for a hot dog place than a gyro place. Witness the fact that there are so few gyro stores around. The manufacturers of the meat are primarily in Chicago - I believe there are two competitors. They make the meat, sell the broilers, make the sauce, etc. Not good for you as the buyer. All you want is the meat..You should make your own uniqe sauce and see if you can get one of the broilers right from the equipment manufacturer, if it is not also owned by the meat companies. Maybe someone is selling one used?

You need to know how the meat is shipped (pounds per cone that is and what is the yield). What is the minimum order. Do you have the refrigeration to store it..What is the shelf life. Where will you get the pita, how will you make the sauce and store it, etc. LOTS TO DO MY FRIEND.

One last thing...Many of us (especially me)think that just because I/we like something, everyone else is going to like it too. I have long questioned the popularity of the gyro. It is one of my favorite things, but is it really popular amongst the masses? That's what you need to know. It is found in so few places and so few places do it right. You need big volume for those broilers. Every day, you have to reheat the cone and the longer you have to keep it and repeat this process, the greater the chance of it going sour on you. That's a financial diaster. Call up the places in Chicago and hope they will be straight with you. They know the volume you'll need to justify the cost of all the equipment, freight charges, etc.

The best gyro guy I ever knew was and still is in South Florida..his name is Tommy and he and his wife own Big Foot's on Griffin Road, in Ft. Lauderdale. That's the dude to talk to. But, Greeks are very reluctant to talk about their business with anyone..Especially a stranger. I say this in a respectful way. They are some of the best businessmen in the restaurant industry.

My home exterminator is Greek and he is one of the guys in charge of the Greek Festival's Gryo Booth here in Daytona Beach. They do the planning of the booth each year, the ordering of the meat out of Chicago, the ordering of the refrigerated trailers to store the meat, etc. If you give me your questions, I could ask Pete.

I think a Gyro stand is a great idea. I base this on one experience.

Quite a few years ago when we were vacationing in St Margarets Bay, NS, I drove into Halifax on some sort of errand with my 14 year old son. After we had completed our business we happened to notice a cricket match being played so we stopped to watch for awhile. I dont remember what our errand was, and I dont know how the cricket match came out, and i still dont understand cricket, but I do remember one of the best Gyros I've ever eaten. A guy was selling Gyros out of a push-cart on the street near the playing field and he was doing a very active business at about lunchtime on a Saturday.

Scotty, if you do s well as that guy seemed to be doing you're onto a good thing.

Cheers, John

quote:

Originally posted by Baah Ben



The manufacturers of the meat are primarily in Chicago - I believe there are two competitors. They make the meat, sell the broilers, make the sauce, etc. Not good for you as the buyer. All you want is the meat..

Nothing stopping him from blending the meat himself.

quote:

Originally posted by scotty7254
I am very interested in starting a Gyro Stand.

I have two main questions. The first is for any reommendations and advice on the whole process and what I should or shouldn't do.
Scott

Gas units are great for a fast heat up but the electric units are cheaper.

A gas unit is a grand or more but you can buy an electric for around $500.But in order to have as fast as possible heat up with electric they are 220 for the heating element and 120 for the rotation motor.

I think you can buy a totally 120 unit but it would take too long to come up to temp. I looked into these a year or so ago during the winter months and many companies that sell the meat offer a leasing plans, but by the time they jack up the price of the meat you end up with $2.80 in a sandwich.So there isn't a great deal of profit in the leasing plan option.

Any company that sells the meat sells the sauce or dressing and they will give you help in doctoring the sauce to make it your own. So recipes are a no brainier.

Hiring help and having someone else run your stand is very very risky but you can do a search here at roadfood and find out the dos and don'ts on that topic.

Health departments are a critical part of this business because they don't want the meat to be on the machine with the heat off for more than a few minutes.So you have to be very careful or they can walk in and take the temp of the meat and force you to trash an entire cone, unless you can convince them you just put it on the spit. Otherwise if you run it all the time it just dries the meat out and it's junk.

This is not something I'd think you can do like a hot dog cart. You'd need a location that was fixed. GFS and many other companies now sell the meat sliced and portioned and vendors use a panini grill or flat top to heat it.Thus they forgo the vertical Gyro grill expense. Now I guess you could do the sliced meat on a charcoal grill so that could make you mobile again. But again the sliced/portioned meat becomes more expensive and increases the sandwich cost. Here is the only customer contact information I saved

Customer Service- CALL 866-483-0328 E-MAIL:customerService@valiantequipment.com

Jack

PS Most vendors sell fries with these but that's another kettle of fish do a search for French Fries here at roadfood.

quote:

Originally posted by diveflNothing stopping him from blending the meat himself.

How in the world would you do that? I can't imagine having to deal with the feds and the work process involved to grind, blend, and finally press it into a cone. Tell me more about how to go about this?
Jack

FIRST Major Problem - "My idea is to hire some local kids that I find very trustworthy and give them a percentage of the profits every night." Lots of Luck!

Dr "Q" thanks for that info on gyros...Good Stuff! I knew the BOH was a real problem. I can't understand how one could even attempt to make one of those gyro meat cones. But......I believe ti is a combination of ground beef and lamb and lots of middle eastern spices. This is made at a factory...A USDA inspected plant...That's how it travels across state lines....to make it yourself? You'd need a BOH approved facility...CRAZY CRAZY CRAZY

I really think a gyro is a very special item and not that popular with a majority of Americans. I love them. And, it is not a cheap item to sell either because you are the middle man..Just like when we sold hot dogs at our restaurant. It was the least profitable item on the menu. Just like bottled sodas and bottled beers. You can only mark them up so much and people start objecting.

By time we figured the unit cost and the freight from NJ for those hot dogs ..The big profit items were everything we made from scratch..fries, hand pattied burgers,meat loaf, meat balls, chili, fountain drinks etc. Yes, the hot dog was the draw to bring in the customers, but the real money was made on the other items.

I remember Alton Brown making it on Good Eats. You could check it out on the Food Channel website.

quote:

Originally posted by Foodbme

FIRST Major Problem - "My idea is to hire some local kids that I find very trustworthy and give them a percentage of the profits every night." Lots of Luck!

I agree. If the success of this start-up is dependent upon using local kids, you might as well go ahead and find a hole to throw your money down and save yourself a lot of anguish.

funny you should ask...
i have been doing alot of research lately on that very same subject. we determined here, that we would sell a gyro on our menu, but limit our greek food to that.
but, the key is location. and of course, you should do the gyro from scratch. its not that hard. http://greekfood.about.com/od/greekfoodphotogalleries/ig/How-Greek-Gyro-is-Made/Gyro-Rotisserie-Grill.htm

its likely less cost effective this way, but absolutely the best product.
the marinade most likely includes some sort of curing agent that keeps the microorganisms at bay, while the cone is in the temp danger zone. that's just my guess.
we found a warmer for a prefab cone for only a thousand dollars.
what you would want, is one that sits on the counter, or in a bay wndow, to draw people in from the sidewalk. the sauce, is pretty easy to make as well. of course there are variations on the prep method, but you can decide which way you are going. ours is something like this...
1 pint sour cream(or Greek-style super thick yoghurt)
1 English cucumber, peeled, grated on a box grater, salted lightly for 5 minutes and squeezed between the hands to remove water(the long, thin, almost seedless kind)
3 garlic cloves, mashed to a paste
1/2 cup olive oil
1 tablespoon red wine vinegar
1 tablespoon minced fresh dill (optional) or fresh mint. or both
salt
Directions
1
Just mix everything up together until it is all blended and the oil has emulsified into the yoghurt/sour cream. Taste for seasoning, and add salt if you think necessary. Put in a resealable container.
2
Allow to 'sit' in the refrigerator for at least 2-3 hours before using to allow the flavors to come out( or over night) has a 7 day shelflife
3
This wonderful meze. it is a thick 'salata'. it is used to counterpoint rich, bbq'd meats (like souvlaki/shish kebab), but can be used in more diverse ways.

the pita bread can be obtained from most supplyers. easy squezzy.

now the big problem that i have with you business plan, is the labor pool. you will find that to be the biggest obstacle. you may have to jump in there, and go part time with your day job. no one will make this great food or serve it like you would, as the owner. plus, without you there, many gyros would go out the door unpaid for(for friends), not to mention tons of other possible complications.
so, i think it would work but i think you will have to commit to being there.

peace out
mike

Geez guys, it's not like gyro meat is some magical recipe that only two people have and can use. Oh no, a cone. As for dealing with the feds...you do know not everything served on the streets is a prepackaged hot dog right? Raw meats become cooked meats all the time from streat vendors. People form them into patties or put them on sticks or mix them with many ingrediants and put them in a tortilla, cut up thier own pigs and slow roast them, etc., etc.

Visit: www.kronosproducts.com and www.devancofoods.com for complete product and marketing information.

CSD PhD-Professor Hot Dogs

quote:

Originally posted by divefl
Geez guys, it's not like gyro meat is some magical recipe that only two people have and can use. Oh no, a cone. As for dealing with the feds...you do know not everything served on the streets is a prepackaged hot dog right? Raw meats become cooked meats all the time from streat vendors. People form them into patties or put them on sticks or mix them with many ingrediants and put them in a tortilla, cut up thier own pigs and slow roast them, etc., etc.

Where is it that you sell food?

Oh, you got me. I do not have a food stand so I should shut up. Of course, I have represented vendors in multiple states so probably am more familiar with law in more than one area which seems to be what you are bringing up. Unless the original poster is trying to open up a stand where your local laws apply, then I yield to you. Otherwise, I think I can contribute even if you don't agree.

quote:

Originally posted by chicagostyledog

Visit: www.kronosproducts.com and www.devancofoods.com for complete product and marketing information.

CSD PhD-Professor Hot Dogs

Thanks for the info CSD. The Kronos site is great!!! They even give you promotional items...

Bassrocker4u2..That was fantastic..Thank you! You learn something everyday on this site. What was shown there has to be the ultimate type of gyro meat and I'd suspect what you'd see in Greece? Looked like pork, lamb, and maybe chicken? I know the ones that are shipped out of Chicago are nothing like this. If you go on the the Kronos site, you can see what is a fabricated, cone shapped product; apparently a gound mixture of what I believe is beef and lamb..Maybe some pork? It's all I've ever had, but the one in the picture gallery looks like what would taste far better.

Boy, I'd really be worried about getting the proper heat to the inside of that skewered meat wouldn't you? You need trememdous volume to make a go of any of these big skewered things regardless of whether it was ground and molded or placed in layered pieces one on top of one another. I just can't get over how they did that. and while it is all being constructed, I'd think you had better be in a refrigerated room to stop bacteria growth.

Never had a gyro with potatoes on it..Not a bad idea. All we ever get is iceberg lettuce, tomatoes, onions, the sauce and tons of the meat. What Tommy does in South Florida (Big Foots, Ft. Lauderdale)that I love is he takes the juices that accumulate in the drip pan under the broiler and brushes some of it on the pita and then he grills it.

I can't wait to show my exterminator, "Pete the Greek" these pictures. He's gonna love this! I will ask him, if this is the type of gryo they have in Greece. He goes to Greece quite often. I will let you know next month. Thanks again Bassrocker.

Thanks for all the recommendations, it's greatly appreciated.

And I completely agree with the response to the trusting local kids comments I made, my family and extended family have been in the food service business there whole life, and I have worked in multiple restaurants, so I know how difficult this can be and how much theft takes place. I have ways around that. I would work certain shifts here and there, and definately in the beginning to get an average of income each night. Then if on certain nights I received less money than expected, I work that night the next week and can find out if theft is taking place. Also tiny hidden video cameras (or even the threat that there is one) can greatly deter theft and free food.

So it sounds like the general concensus is that a hot dog stand would be easier, appeal more to the masses, and likely more profitable than a Gyro stand??

And by "Kids" I was just being very general. I would rather hire someone older that I could trust more, but I assumed the majority of the interested poeple that I would consider would be in there 20's. I certianly wouldn't go much younger than that.

quote:

Nothing stopping him from blending the meat himself.

Half-and-half lamb and beef, and 'greek seasoning'. Bake it in mini-loaf pans; cool and slice. Portion and refrigerate or freeze. Toss on flat-top with pita to order.

Easy peasy. No special equipment and if nobody buys it....you aren't out anything.

Kinsman - So you grind up the two meats and add the seasonings..Any specific cuts of the lamb or beef (I have to believe Kronos is using the cheapest cuts!) So, I guess lots of oregano, salt, pepper and what else?

Sounds do able for me. I know how to make the sauce.

quote:

Originally posted by Baah Ben

....

Boy, I'd really be worried about getting the proper heat to the inside of that skewered meat wouldn't you? You need trememdous volume to make a go of any of these big skewered things regardless of whether it was ground and molded or placed in layered pieces one on top of one another. I just can't get over how they did that. and while it is all being constructed, I'd think you had better be in a refrigerated room to stop bacteria growth. .....

OK, my 2 cents worth.

While I was in the middle east, I eat Shawarmers (beef, chicken or lamb). They are the same as the Gyro but with middle eastern seasonings. To my recollection the center of the meat cones did not cook. The meat cones were cold and the cooker was very hot. The outside of the cone seared quickly and the meat was shaved off to the raw meat. So if sales were good and fast the meat would stay cold until cooked. I have seen the vendor change the meat cones for cold one from the frig it the one he was using was getting warm.

So cooking the center of the cone should not be a problem if the vendor keeps it cold. Also, I think using the small cones should be better for a street vendor and easier for him to keep cold and change if needed.

quote:

Originally posted by divefl
Oh, you got me. I do not have a food stand so I should shut up. Of course, I have represented vendors in multiple states so probably am more familiar with law in more than one area which seems to be what you are bringing up.I think I can contribute even if you don't agree.

I don't think anyone told you to shut up. I asked what your involvement in the food business was, and I'm still asking? You said "I have represented vendors in multiple states so probably am more familiar". So I guess your an attorney is that correct? Or an insurance agent, perhaps? Or if not how did you "represent vendors in multiple states"? Maybe I need to hire someone to "represent my company in multiple states"?
Thank You
Jack

quote:

Originally posted by bassrocker4u2

funny you should ask... i have been doing alot of research lately on that very same subject. we determined here, that we would sell a gyro on our menu, but limit our greek food to that.But, the key is location. and of course, you should do the gyro from scratch. its not that hard. http://greekfood.about.com/od/greekfoodphotogalleries/ig/How-Greek-Gyro-is-Made/Gyro-Rotisserie-Grill.htm
its likely less cost effective this way, but absolutely the best product.
Peace out mike

I didn't see where this slide show was from, but I have to tell you in central Illinois I don't think this entire process would ever be allowed by the health department. Now in Southern Illinois near St Louis you could get away with it but not in any county that had a strict health department. I just called a health department in southern Illinois about an event permit and they sent me one in the mail no inspection nothing. So some areas are pretty lax.

And I suppose if you had a kick ass restaurant and served really big numbers at lunch and would sell this in a mater of a few (very few) hours that would be one thing.

But that said if you were to precook this (which I'd think you would have to do) you would have to cook the hell out of it in order to get the center done. That long cooking process would turn the outside to a hard bark like burnt ends. Then if you didn't sell it and stuck it in the reach in to cool and took it out the next day how long is it going to take it to warm in the center. All the reheating time the center is dead in the danger zone. I'm not now nor have I ever been a health department inspector but I have dealt with a bunch of them and our local guys and gals would go nuts over this process.

Unless I'm missing something here the only legal way to do this would be to build it and start selling slices until your done with lunch hour and chuck the left oversw.

If you built it and kept it on the spit cooking constantly and it didn't sell it would burn up the outside. If you built it and sold half you'd have to continue cooking it until it was up to temp including the center.

If you put any left over in the reach in well I covered that.If I'm wrong here let me know because I have had an idea for years that is similar but does not involve Gryos.

Jack

quote:

Originally posted by edwmax

OK, my 2 cents worth. While I was in the middle east, I eat Shawarmers (beef, chicken or lamb). They are the same as the Gyro but with middle eastern seasonings. To my recollection the center of the meat cones did not cook. The meat cones were cold and the cooker was very hot. The outside of the cone seared quickly and the meat was shaved off to the raw meat. So if sales were good and fast the meat would stay cold until cooked. I have seen the vendor change the meat cones for cold one from the frig it the one he was using was getting warm.So cooking the center of the cone should not be a problem if the vendor keeps it cold. Also, I think using the small cones should be better for a street vendor and easier for him to keep cold and change if needed.

That's interesting but what happens when the health department sticks a temp probe into this chunk of meat on the spit? One inch deep and it's at 145....... one and a half and it's at 140....... two inches and it's at 135 and at three inches deep and the temp is at who knows?

I just don't see how this would work.

Somebody anybody clue me in.
Thanks
Jack

quote:

Originally posted by Dr of BBQ

quote:

Originally posted by edwmax

OK, my 2 cents worth. While I was in the middle east, I eat Shawarmers (beef, chicken or lamb). They are the same as the Gyro but with middle eastern seasonings. To my recollection the center of the meat cones did not cook. The meat cones were cold and the cooker was very hot. The outside of the cone seared quickly and the meat was shaved off to the raw meat. So if sales were good and fast the meat would stay cold until cooked. I have seen the vendor change the meat cones for cold one from the frig it the one he was using was getting warm.So cooking the center of the cone should not be a problem if the vendor keeps it cold. Also, I think using the small cones should be better for a street vendor and easier for him to keep cold and change if needed.

That's interesting but what happens when the health department sticks a temp probe into this chunk of meat on the spit? One inch deep and it's at 145....... one and a half and it's at 140....... two inches and it's at 135 and at three inches deep and the temp is at who knows?

I just don't see how this would work.

Somebody anybody clue me in.
Thanks
Jack

The cone has been out too long and needs to be chilled. How long does it take for the center of a 10 lb cone too warm up? Remember the heat is not penetrating the meat as it is being sliced off as it cooks. The vendor needs to be aware of the meat temp and re-chill as required.

You stated below this is not a good method of cooking for Slow sales, True. I think the vendor would need to cook and slice off some meat and keep at serving temp or keep the cone in the frig, taking it out to cook as he gets an order when sales are slow.

This is why I don’t think the large 40lb cone would be good for most vendors. The 10 lb cones can be exchanged with a cold one about every 40 to 50 min. if not used up.

Dr. before you ask, I’m not a shawarmer vendor and am not claiming to be an expert, but this is what I have seen the street vendor in the middle east doing. The street vendor cannot afford to let their meat go bad or their customer get sick from their product. They would lose all their business. AND, uhmmm those things were damn gooood, I miss'um

So would a hot dog stand be easier and more profitable than a Gryo stand?

quote:

Originally posted by Baah Ben

Kinsman - So you grind up the two meats and add the seasonings..Any specific cuts of the lamb or beef (I have to believe Kronos is using the cheapest cuts!) So, I guess lots of oregano, salt, pepper and what else?

Sounds do able for me. I know how to make the sauce.

Basically salt, pepper, oregano, lemon, garlic. Google is your friend. The meat we use is ground chuck, and lamb roast that we buy at Costco. It's fairly lean. I grind each one once then grind together with the spices.

The smaller size loaves make for a slice of the proper width, and because it's precooked, the worries about holding temps are nil. Easy peasy, and makes a pretty good product, too. Even if your customers don't see you slicing their sandwich off the big hunk of meat on the rotisserie.....

quote:

Originally posted by scotty7254

So would a hot dog stand be easier and more profitable than a Gryo stand?

I think hot dogs and shawarmer/gyro would work great together at fairs or ballgames where sales would be quick.

Some people may not like a hot dog but I think would eat a all-beef or chicken shawarmer/gyro. Build them simple

I don't think I would like a meatloaf on a stick or baked meatloaf, refried and served in pita bread as a gyro. It just would not have the same flavor as the dry roasted/seared meat from the rotisserie.