Too early for college football? ('09 Version)

Davydd

EatingTheRoad

Scorereader


and with ND's schedule, they shouldn't have done worse than 10-2. Weiss era is going to come to an end. They're only nationally relevant because of their history, and because Lou Holz is a commentator for ESPN.

Wow...very well said, I wholeheartedly agree.

Anyone else looking forward to the USC v Stanford game?

I don't know if I entirely agree. History yes. But also tradition, alumni and a national schedule as say opposed to Florida and Alabama who play absolutely no one outside of the southeast. Aren't most all the Notre Dame games on NBC and not ESPN/ABC? I doubt many put much credence in what Lou Holtz says anymore. Notre Dame has always had one fault. They frequently have a difficult time hiring a good coach.

 
National schedule?

Yeah, because they haven't the cojones to join a conference, because they know they won't win one - except maybe the Big East, who they are using for just about every other sport.

Their schedule is mostly a hodgepodge of Big Ten and Pac-10 teams. So, their schedule isn't really any more "national" than USC's.

I'm sick of that argument. Navy plays a National schedule too, but they don't get money from the BCS for losing.
 
Couple more points: 1 - college football fans watch ESPN coverage of college football. ND games may be on NBC, but ALL the commentary is on ESPN. It's not an issue of NBC airing the game, it's that anyone who is a real college football fan watches ESPN analysis.
 
And while Lou can be a fun target to jab with his wacky ways, ND fans should be a little nicer, because unlike the last few coaches, he actually led ND to a National Championship. And he wasn't riding on anyone's coat tails. He follow Gerry Faust, who had the worst winning percentage of any ND coach up to that point.
 
Except for Willingham's first year going 10-2 with Bob Davie's recruits, ND has not been a national concern since Holtz 's departure in 1996.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Rutgers dragged USF behind the woodshed last night.  USF didnt look like it could do anything right.

Scorereader

Couple more points: 1 - college football fans watch ESPN coverage of college football. ND games may be on NBC, but ALL the commentary is on ESPN. It's not an issue of NBC airing the game, it's that anyone who is a real college football fan watches ESPN analysis.

I long ago quit watching bloviating talking heads on ESPN and pre-game shows. I'm too old to waste my time on that stuff. Just watch the games and that is sometimes better with the sound turned down or off. They ought to offer TV technology where you can turn on the play by play man and turn off the color commentator.

You could always mute it and have the radio broadcast on.

My grandfather would always have the TV muted during soccer matches, occasionally a friend of mine would be over and ask him why he didn't have the sound on...he'd look at them and smile and un-mute it, it was in Spanish, which he didn't speak...this always got a good laugh.

Eatingtheroad: unfortunately, thanks to costume malfunctions, there's a 7 or 8 second delay - which is aggravating when opting to listen to the radio commentators and watch the tv.

davydd: despite your opinion, I like turning on ESPN analysis to catch up on sports news, college football in particular, around the country. It's informative. I don't really watch it, but I clean the entire 1st floor of my house while listening  and can even get the week's ironing done. Kirk and Lee, et al, are entertaining. I can watch the game and make my own assessments as well, but I only watch one game per week, so I leave the assessment of other games, up to the folks who watch the games.

Personally, I don't need a play by play guy. I can see the game. I don't need to know that so-and-so has dropped back to a pass - I can see that clear with my own eyes. I'd rather listen to the color commentary guy having some fun.

 

A dilemma-----not for me but for my next door neighbor.

She is a Pitt graduate and member of the 52 Olympics.  She is also open minded and smart----so she loves Notre Dame.  Tonight we will watch together, and just love the competition ------may the better team win.

Man, last weeks game, I didn't feel like commenting after that. Thank goodness I didn't get a chance to see any of it.


This year ND has the talent to have won it all. Think about it; Claussen, love him or hate him, has really evolved. He's going to be a good pro, something I never thought about Quinn. He has THREE future pros at receiver in Tate, Floyd and Rudolph; even with Floyd out half the year, he had one more than any other QB in the country. And they can run the ball. 552 average yards per game, that should win you a few. Against an average schedule, the best teams being a weak (for them) USC and now Pitt, they should have gone 12-0.

What is missing is coaching and discipline. The O line is the best it's been in 15 years, but they keep killing themselves with stupid penalties. The defense is horrible, but there are enough individually talented players that you have to wonder if they ever attended a meeting together.

IMO Weis is a grifter, a con man. Sure, he knows his Xs and Os. But he sold the school a bill of goods, then walked in and started tossing his considerable weight and ego around. Now the jig is up. I seriously doubt that Weis will get another college coaching job, nor any head coaching job. And his demeanor is such that he'll never make it in the broadcasting booth.

I went to Pitt; it's great to see them playing so well. Dave Wannstedt has done a good job under some pretty decent academic rules of his own. Tonight we'll see just how much of it is real; if they put a stomping on my boys, then it's real. If They squeak out a win, or if ND wins, then Pitt's record is an indictment of Big East football in general, and look for Cincinnati to get exposed and blown out in early January.

You'll never see a Pitt/PSU game again as long as JoPa has a say in it. He has some sort of grudge from 20 years ago. But that would be a good one.

Mosca


IMO Weis is a grifter, a con man. Sure, he knows his Xs and Os. But he sold the school a bill of goods, then walked in and started tossing his considerable weight and ego around. Now the jig is up. I seriously doubt that Weis will get another college coaching job, nor any head coaching job. And his demeanor is such that he'll never make it in the broadcasting booth.

That's Notre Dame's fault. Why did they hire an assistant coach from the pros with no head coaching experience? When they learn to hire proven college coaches they might start winning more with their talent. Notre Dame almost self-recruits off its name regardless of who is coach. Example of that is Notre Dame has always gotten the best blue chippers out of Minnesota from the perennial powerhouse Catholic high school, Cretin-Derham Hall, in St. Paul. Michael Floyd is the latest example. The University of Minnesota can't compete against them in recruiting. I'm sure every major city with a city wide powerhouse Catholic high school is similar. If Notre Dame comes calling it is almost a shoe in to always be in consideration. That's a heckuva nationwide advantage.

Well, yeah. I agree. Except the more mistakes they make, and the further they get from the glory days, the weaker those advantages become.

Dave----#1 recruit in the nation Henderson is from Cretin-Derham
but it looks like he wants out of the snows of Minny-sota and In-dee-anna----it looks like he will be headed for the beachs near USC. 

if ND got the top guys from Catholic HS they would not have to recruit at all, but 3/4 of their kids don't come from catholic Schools, and many aren't even Catholic. 

Just pass the entrance exam---even if you are a Mormon. 
They may even lose Barr whose father and uncle played at ND and whose mother went to St Mary's across the street. 

Top CB in the country is having trouble getting in because of marks.   

Since I'm quite certain that y'all have been just dying to hear my year-end predictions, here they are.

I predict that the BCS championship game will be between Florida and Texas.  I can't predict who would win that one, but I predict it will be a helluva game.

The Heisman will go to Colt McCoy, although Jordan Shipley deserves it a lot more.

Thus Spoke Zarabushie

Bushie


I predict that the BCS championship game will be between Florida and Texas. 

The Florida offense has been very inconsistent without Percy Harvin. I think they finally lose in the SEC championship game & it's 'Bama & Texas playing for the glass football.

I see about three or four guys that have a better chance of getting the Heisman than McCoy.  He may not even be in the top 3 QB's in college football.  And Golden Tate has put up similar to better numbers than Shipley, but when you add in Tate's returns and rushing abilities, he blows Shipley out of the water.

the ancient mariner


Dave----#1 recruit in the nation Henderson is from Cretin-Derham
but it looks like he wants out of the snows of Minny-sota and In-dee-anna----it looks like he will be headed for the beachs near USC. 

if ND got the top guys from Catholic HS they would not have to recruit at all, but 3/4 of their kids don't come from catholic Schools, and many aren't even Catholic. 

Just pass the entrance exam---even if you are a Mormon. 
They may even lose Barr whose father and uncle played at ND and whose mother went to St Mary's across the street. 

Top CB in the country is having trouble getting in because of marks.   

With what you say Mariner, then Charlie Weis is proving not to be a good recruiter either. 6 and 4 and they could easily end up 6 and 6 and probably definitely 7 and 5 with the way Stanford is playing lately.

cavandre



The Florida offense has been very inconsistent without Percy Harvin. I think they finally lose in the SEC championship game & it's 'Bama & Texas playing for the glass football.

That's a definite possibility, but I had to out on the limb.

saps


I see about three or four guys that have a better chance of getting the Heisman than McCoy.  He may not even be in the top 3 QB's in college football.  And Golden Tate has put up similar to better numbers than Shipley, but when you add in Tate's returns and rushing abilities, he blows Shipley out of the water.

I'm not saying McCoy is the best.  I'm saying he'll win it.

Dave----------I just wanted to confirm in my own mind that ND is not getting all the hot shots from Catholic Prep Schools.  I went to the 17 verbal commitments so far this year and looked up their High School.

15 are from regular High Schools
-  Andrew Hendrix goes to Moeller in Ohio and
-  Gio Bernard goes to St Thomas Acquinas in Florida. 

Now that Charlie Weis looks like a Lame Duck----and he does,
some of the 17 may leave also.  ND will have a team on the
field next year even if there are no prima donnas --- they
may lose as many as they win----but they will be competitive
and the kids will graduate with a damn good education.

Branch Rickey once traded for a guy named Eddie Stanky.  When 
asked why, he said---He can't run, he can't throw, he can't hit, and
he can't field------all he does is beat you.  I would prefer 22 Eddie 
Stanky types on the field wouldn't you ? 

But they don't have 22 Eddie Stanky types, and they're not really beating anyone of consequence.  What they do have is three top 10 recruiting classes from 06-08, and # 21 in '09, and really nothing to show for it.

Saps------I agree with you and that is why Charlie Weis is on his way back to the NFL.  Those kids are too good to lose so many games to lesser opponents.  Hey, I have rooted for ND through thick and thin and will continue no matter what.

Yankee fans come and go depending on the won-lost column but fans of the
Fighting Irish are true green.

I used to be a huge ND fan growing up, but I unfortunately know a lot of people that have graduated from Notre Dame.  Some are great guys, but a large group of them are an arrogant and exclusionary bunch that think that ND is God's gift to football.  Living in the Chicago area, there is a huge network of Domers, so I tend to get overexposed, and I used to belong to a country club that is loaded with them, so I've heard and seen enough.

That said, even though I think Claussen is a whiny one, there is no denying the talent of him and Tate (I have a neighbor who is good friends with him, and by all accounts he's a great guy).  ND used to be marked by great defense, marked by guys like Patulski, Browner, Duerson, Crable and on.  They used to have excellent defensive backfields.  They need to get some decent defenses in there before they can begin to make any noise.

saps,

My sister went to grad school at ND and lives in Wood Dale. She echoes the sentiment you expressed in your first paragraph. All I can say is that there are some like that, and there are some who want to change the world. Mrs Mosca's family is devoutly Catholic, and I get to meet a lot of ND people who fit the second set. My daughter called last week and wanted to know if she could go away for spring break, not to Ft Lauderdale or Cancun but to Guatemala on a humanitarian mission. ND is a big place.

Yeah, Claussen is pretty cocky, not in a good way. I wonder how much of that is learned from Weis. Or, how much of that would have been scrubbed off of him by a classy guy like Willingham.

Re: Weis and his recuiting, Dan Shaugnessy writes from today's SI online, "It's easy now to look back and say that Weis' first two seasons (9-3 and 10-3) were tributes to Willingham's recruiting skills... [a]nd Charlie stopped winning after Willingham's recruits left South Bend." I would go further and say that Weis has recruited better, but coached and instructed much worse. Willingham's guys got better over their time at ND, Weis's guys did not grow and improve the same way, as a team. Much was made about how Claussen, on his own, invited Tate and Floyd to California over the summer, to work together. It is interesting to me that this didn't happen in actual "team time".

Mosca-

I hope I didn't offend you by my assessment.  There are a lot of good kids from that school, and the Notre Dame network in the Midwest, Chicago in particular, is a great asset if you are looking for a job.  I know a girl that went there for undergrad, went on missions, and is now a professor at Yale.  Great person.

To be honest, if my kids got into Notre Dame, I would be very happy.

I don't mind Claussen's cockiness- for a quarterback, that's a good thing.  I just think that he seems to be a complainer, but he is a winner, and I'd take him on the Bears, except that we already have a talented, cocky, whiny quarterback who makes Claussen seem like Mr. Rogers.

I do think a good Notre Dame is good for college football.  They are a polarizing entity, and it always makes the matchups more interesting.

Today ---Nov 21 is a big day----a 2 to 3 TD day

The Irish over Conn by 14 to 21 points

Penn State over MSU by the same margin---

You can book it !!!!

Mariner,

You can't book the Irish over Conn now by 14 to 21 points. They could lose too. It's in overtime, 20 to 20. But you could be right about Penn State.

Well, Notre Dame lost to UConn in double overtime.

Yeah, but Florida and Tim Tebow dominated FIU.  Now there's something to be proud of.

saps


Yeah, but Florida and Tim Tebow dominated FIU.  Now there's something to be proud of.

Point taken, but the bottom line is they beat all the teams they play. Go Gators!!

saps


Yeah, but Florida and Tim Tebow dominated FIU.  Now there's something to be proud of.

Proud...no   Smart...Yes
 
Gators still have to face FSU & then 'Bama in the SEC championship. Scheduling a JV squad at this point in their schedule was a smart thing to do...no one got hurt, most of the starters were riding the bench from the 3rd quarter on & backups got valuable playing time.

Davydd


Well, Notre Dame lost to UConn in double overtime.

I have no official opinion on ND but I'm glad UConn won. That's more than a swan song for Weiss. I'm guess they go down to Stanford next week too.

That was probably the most exciting Saturday I've seen in a while! What was your favorite game?
Stanford/Cal
Oregon/Arizona
ND/UConn
Ohio/Michigan
Ole Miss/LS (pitiful)
Northwestern/Wisconsin

Oregon vs. Oregon State is going to be fun!

I loved Arizona and University of Oregon. It was as exciting a game as i have seen all year.