Hot!True Value

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Turtle66
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2014/03/20 04:07:23 (permalink)

True Value

A 40 Thousand Dollar Culinary Degree? Le Cordon Bleu is changing their recruiting tactics. After a few former students sued (and won) Le Cordon Bleu for not living up to all its claims: "Jobs starting at 40k a year. Some Chefs making as much as 60k per year, and alway being in high demand etc" Not only were the students having difficulty finding jobs after graduation, But the jobs they were able to obtain were entry level jobs dishwashers,Prep Cooks minimum wage paying jobs that anyone can get (no degree needed) Needless to say they could not afford to pay off their 40k student loans and felt they were duped. Le Cordon Bleu decided to settle out of court for an undisclosed amount and drastically change its new student recruiting tactics. 40k is allot to pay for a piece of paper, But that piece of paper sure looks good framed hanging over the mantle on the wall at mom and dads house.   
 
#1

33 Replies Related Threads

    MellowRoast
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 07:46:55 (permalink)
    When a friend of mine told me her tuition to Johnson & Wales was $40,000 I practically fell out of my chair.  Sadly, she's unemployed at this time.
    #2
    brisketboy
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 09:39:49 (permalink)
    That seems to be pretty much the norm. We have entry level folks coming to work for us that were fed that line and got a four degree from UT and look to be in their forty's before they've paid off their student loans.
    #3
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 10:49:40 (permalink)
    I went to LaVarenne and had great-paying jobs my entire career.  My first job was sous chef and after that, always executive chef.  No complaints here.
    #4
    WarToad
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 10:57:40 (permalink)
    I'm glad I went to a state college back in the 80s.  4 years for 12k total seems a steal today.
    #5
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 11:10:18 (permalink)
    Yep.  My 4 years at Westminster were also 12k but it was a private school.  That was in the 70s.
    #6
    pnwchef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 13:33:37 (permalink)
    I never needed a piece of paper, I sold myself. I worked my way up in this business. I made 6 figures for my last 20 years. I think most people feel they need a degree to get what they want. I was lucky, I had a lot of people believe in me, I never let them down..............pnwc
    #7
    Turtle66
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 18:38:15 (permalink)
    pnwchef

    I never needed a piece of paper, I sold myself. I worked my way up in this business. I made 6 figures for my last 20 years. I think most people feel they need a degree to get what they want. I was lucky, I had a lot of people believe in me, I never let them down..............pnwc

    My sentiments exact,  
    #8
    MetroplexJim
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 18:56:21 (permalink)
    A question:  what is the relationship, if any, between the 'real' Le Cordon Bleu of Paris, France and the schools that trade under that name all over the U.S.?
     
    --------------
     
    Kinda related: the Art Institutes (corporate HQ in Pitsburgh) has branches all over the country that also have Culinary Institutes.  The branch here in Dallas has a wonderful 'restaurant lab' that serves a $15 lunch that one would easily pay $30 for elsewhere.  And, as the fledgling chefs rotate into server shifts, the service is truly wonderful.
    post edited by MetroplexJim - 2014/03/20 18:57:54
    #9
    tmiles
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 19:04:11 (permalink)
    I hear again and again that the restaurant biz is a true meritocracy. The cream rises to the top, based on hard work and skill. The sorry owner who hires a jerk manager quickly sees the best folks leave.  The jerk owner is quickly out of business.
    #10
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/20 19:23:36 (permalink)
    MetroplexJim

    A question:  what is the relationship, if any, between the 'real' Le Cordon Bleu of Paris, France and the schools that trade under that name all over the U.S.?

    --------------


    I can answer that!  One of the chefs that taught at LaVarenne moved on and became an instructor at Cordon Bleu.  His name is Patrick Martin and he's the head of international affairs of Cordon Bleu.  Fortunately, the Cordon Bleu continues it's culinary instruction on almost all continents.  LaVarenne under Anne Willan has pretty much folded. 
    #11
    CCJPO
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/22 23:53:22 (permalink)
    College is expensive today. I got in when it was cheap. It was 96 dollars for tuition a quarter. And that was for 12 hours, anything above 12 hours was still 96 bucks. Grad school was 250 bucks per quarter. Still inexpensive. Rent for two years was 90 dollars a quarter. Then I bought a trailer in a trailer park. That was 2200, sold it when I was done for 3200.. Important to keep in mind cheap ass beer was 99 cents a sixer, bread, ten for a buck, monkfish 25 cents per pound, as was halibut, as they were considered trash fish. And I made 2.25 an hour plus tips s a bartender. Life was good.
    #12
    MetroplexJim
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/23 08:43:43 (permalink)
    College/university/trade schoool education presents an interesting economic model where very few actually pay 'list price'.  Only the truly wealthy pay full list for the prestige institutions (e.g., Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Carnegie-Mellon).  It's much like the 'rack rate' at hotels which only a few fools pay. 
     
    Every school 'finds a way' to gouge as much as they can while remaining at the extreme margin of every family's 'affordablibility'.
     
    A dirty little secret is that it does not pay for parents to save for their children's education.  The institutions will simply grab the savings account and charge you what they would have anyway. 
     
    Now that Uncle Sugar has taken over the student loan industry cheap money and extravagantly lenient repayment terms are available to everyone who wants to 'buy in' to the proposition that entering adult like with no home, no car, and a six-figure debt is the 'way to go'.
    post edited by MetroplexJim - 2014/03/23 08:47:25
    #13
    jman
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/23 10:39:19 (permalink)
    MetroplexJim

    College/university/trade schoool education presents an interesting economic model where very few actually pay 'list price'.  Only the truly wealthy pay full list for the prestige institutions (e.g., Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Carnegie-Mellon).  It's much like the 'rack rate' at hotels which only a few fools pay. 

    Every school 'finds a way' to gouge as much as they can while remaining at the extreme margin of every family's 'affordablibility'.

    A dirty little secret is that it does not pay for parents to save for their children's education.  The institutions will simply grab the savings account and charge you what they would have anyway. 

    Now that Uncle Sugar has taken over the student loan industry cheap money and extravagantly lenient repayment terms are available to everyone who wants to 'buy in' to the proposition that entering adult like with no home, no car, and a six-figure debt is the 'way to go'.

     
    Hammer meets nail squarely!
    #14
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/23 12:13:55 (permalink)
    MetroplexJim 




    A dirty little secret is that it does not pay for parents to save for their children's education.  The institutions will simply grab the savings account and charge you what they would have anyway. 


    My father started saving money for my college education the day I was born.  I never had to get a student loan.  When I went to LaVarenne it was initially my uncle's idea.  He and my father split the cost.  I guess I was just very lucky.
    #15
    tmiles
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/23 13:45:37 (permalink)
    Today it is very difficult for a college student to make much, "working her way through college".  IMO, the college loan problem is going to plague this country for a long time. If you think it is not your problem, think again. For those of us about to enter retirement, the kids will not be able to pay the taxes to take care of us. The fixes, whatever they are, will be painful.
     
    "Tax the rich, feed the poor, 'til there are no rich no more"
    #16
    3 Olives
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/23 18:37:32 (permalink)
    MellowRoast

    When a friend of mine told me her tuition to Johnson & Wales was $40,000 I practically fell out of my chair.  Sadly, she's unemployed at this time.


    I think it depends on where you graduated from and where you are willing to work. Some schools have a 90+ placement record.
    #17
    brisketboy
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 08:56:11 (permalink)
    From my perspective we got UT, Baylor, Texas Tech and A&M pumping out "graduates" every year and I see a lot of them wearing paper hats asking if I want fries with that.
    #18
    Phildelmar
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 11:09:01 (permalink)
    I agree. The term " working my way through college" went away some time ago. I did it but couldn't nowadays
    #19
    Sundancer7
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 11:39:47 (permalink)
    Phildelmar

    I agree. The term " working my way through college" went away some time ago. I did it but couldn't nowadays

     
    Roz is doing it right now.  She has paid for masters and now Ph.D. as she goes.  She is getting ready to start her dissertation.  It has took every dime she made to pay for both programs.  I have no idea of the total cost but I estimate the total cost for both degrees are close to $400,000.  I have no idea how she does it.  Working a full time job and coming home and getting into the books until midnight or later.  I will say she is focused.  I would not have the discipline to do it.  I wonder if the degrees will ever pay back????
     
    Paul E. Smith
    Knoxville, TN 

    #20
    brisketboy
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 11:51:23 (permalink)
    That would depend entirely on the area of learning. Austin in particular is still hiring but only in the tech sector. I'm sure that other areas of the country have their particular skill set requirements. But if what you say is true the average collage graduate enters the workplace with crippling debt. That's scary.
    #21
    tmiles
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 16:22:20 (permalink)
    There was a story on the Boston area biz news today. There is a shortage of qualified employees in Mass, yet lots of grads don't have good work. The host said that, today, companies require a perfect fit. Even knowing where the jobs are "today", does one little good when you get a degree a few years down the line, and something else is "in". This is the same show where I first heard, "What is the new Art History degree???? Answer, the MBA.
     
    When I graduated in 1972 the recruiters who came to campus were looking for bright, personable kids, and were willing to train them. When I left active duty from the Marines in late 1974, (peacetime), military job fairs had lots of great companies who were happy to train the "right person". Today, vets and college grads are competing with tons of folks for good jobs. On the other hand a friends daughter who has been getting great grades in accounting from an above average college, already has a $65k job offer upon graduation this spring. She can afford to pay her loans.
    #22
    chewingthefat
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 17:11:19 (permalink)
    I had on the job training in the Restaurant Industry...I bought one, took all the things I hated when I went to a Restaurant, and eliminated them. Took all the BBQ foods I loved and perfected them, worked in the Kitchen as the Pitmaster/Chef/ Sous Chef/ Prep Cook/ whatever, 110 hrs. a week, I was 55 when I started, it almost killed me, but I WOULDN'T give in, too much pride and $ to lose. I've always been a good cook, knowing the Chemistry, Biology of cooking is a must. Consistency is without a doubt, totally important, public relations and promotion, totally important. I got the idea for this BBQ from reading the Stern's "Roadfood" book in 2000. Thank you Jane and Michael!
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    Greymo
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 17:19:51 (permalink)
    Tom, you are a true gem.  You have my greatest admiration............as does the rest of my family and friends!
    #24
    chewingthefat
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 17:31:42 (permalink)
    Greymo

    Tom, you are a true gem.  You have my greatest admiration............as does the rest of my family and friends!

    Thank You Greymo, the same back at you and the gang. Your delightful, as is Art and your beautiful Daughter-in- Law, and those amazing Grandchildren!

    #25
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 18:11:23 (permalink)
    Tom,
    You're pretty good for a rookie.    The restaurant biz has to be one of the toughest.  You have a restaurant you can be proud of.  It sure does take a lot of hard work and you put in long hours.  In the end it pays off.  You done good, my friend. 
    #26
    MetroplexJim
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 18:52:39 (permalink)
    lleechef

    MetroplexJim 




    A dirty little secret is that it does not pay for parents to save for their children's education.  The institutions will simply grab the savings account and charge you what they would have anyway. 


    My father started saving money for my college education the day I was born.  I never had to get a student loan.  When I went to LaVarenne it was initially my uncle's idea.  He and my father split the cost.  I guess I was just very lucky.


    Times have changed.
     
    You went  to school prior to the present 'system'.  Again, 'they' will grab whatever liquid cash your family has, then will charge them what they would have anyway based on the family income. 
     
    The proper way to look at college savings accounts presently is to regard it as an endowment gift to one's prospective alma mater prior to becoming an alum.  My advice: hide any such funds in the Caymans before filling out the FAFSA.
    #27
    lleechef
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 19:00:51 (permalink)
    MetroplexJim

    lleechef

    MetroplexJim 




    A dirty little secret is that it does not pay for parents to save for their children's education.  The institutions will simply grab the savings account and charge you what they would have anyway. 


    My father started saving money for my college education the day I was born.  I never had to get a student loan.  When I went to LaVarenne it was initially my uncle's idea.  He and my father split the cost.  I guess I was just very lucky.


    Times have changed.

    You went  to school prior to the present 'system'.  Again, 'they' will grab whatever liquid cash your family has, then will charge them what they would have anyway based on the family income. 

    The proper way to look at college savings accounts presently is to regard it as an endowment gift to one's prospective alma mater prior to becoming an alum.  My advice: hide any such funds in the Caymans before filling out the FAFSA.

    Sometimes it's good to be old.  And educated.  With no loans.
    #28
    tmiles
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/24 19:25:58 (permalink)
    Jim is right. An older friend had his wife quit work before her income would count. Their son, a good kid with above average but not superior brainpower got lots of money. A neighbor in the same job (teacher) with a much smarter kid got little because the wife kept her job (nurse). My buddy is still bragging 20 years later. Word gets around, and like the "hide your assets from the nursing home" middle class scam, soon "everyone" will be doing it.
     
    Back to the original post, I still think that the cream rises to the top, high class degree or not. It is the "C" student, who will get the least bang for college/tech school buck.
    #29
    chewingthefat
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    Re:True Value 2014/03/25 17:22:01 (permalink)
    lleechef

    Tom,
    You're pretty good for a rookie.    The restaurant biz has to be one of the toughest.  You have a restaurant you can be proud of.  It sure does take a lot of hard work and you put in long hours.  In the end it pays off.  You done good, my friend. 

    Thanks Lisa, it has been a great trip, glad I took it!
    #30
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