introduction....and the general plan

New member here, and have found some really useful discussions and information as I browse. 
 
I am yet another sucker, who wants to open his own place. 20+ years fine-dining kitchen-side experience, who is looking to create something "less complicated" than all the euro-trash sold daily. No offense to European food, I'm just a little tired of people who prefer a large paragraph/short novel to describe a dish. Worse than that, I've read the "tomato thread" and and firmly believe it doesn't matter how fancy your recipe is when you're using a stock FSA/Sysco tomato. 
 
I'm here at roadfood because I would like to utilize a concession trailer as the basis for a 100% take-out establishment, but it would be stationary. So it seems like all the knowledgeable folks here would be a great resource. 
 
I need to go to work in a minute, but figured I should introduce myself and get started on post-count, because sometimes it's easier to explain what I'm thinking/asking through pictures/links. 
 
Sometime later I put up my "general plan", and you all can bash it

welcome Cracker !
nice to see a new face around these parts.....great intro BTW
what sort of trailer or you looking at using ?
 
and i agree....."production" tomatoes are good foods worst enemy! 

Thanks for the kind welcome BAB, but before I get to the trailer, or any of the other details, I figure I'd get the trouble out of the way first and announce that I have $0. 
 
Yep. You read that right, no cash.
 
I'm gonna let that one sit for a day, and see if anyone wants to tell me it's impossible, before outlining how I intend to operate, and why it might be desirable to a private investor. 
 
I'm not ignorant, and my head is not (completely) full of ridiculous fantasies, and I honestly think that if I can crunch the numbers just right (even accounting for inflation), and develop a cost/revenue structure with shorter-than-average pay-off period, and low nominal sales break-even point, it might interest risk-takers. 
 
As I look over my thoughts/plans it's become obvious that a restaurant is a dynamic machine, and that many components all need to function well together to be successful, a passion for food alone will not do it. A passion for profit will show up in reduced food quality. A passion for service will mean nothing if your product isn't suited to your customer base. And so on and so on....
 
For me, I'm interested in creating a comprehensive outline for success, and if I can do that, I should be able to find funding.

I can tell that your excited about the dream but don't jump in deep water without a life jacket. I don't know anything about you or you, me. My names Mike and I just open a mobile bbq truck here in Omaha. It has taken 5yrs to build this business from the ground up. all I started with was a $600 dollar bread van without a engine and transmission. I spent every penney I could spare and then reseached on top of that for those years. Made what I couldn't afford and played the waiting game with the rest. Also God provided it all to me.  I'm about $2000.00 down and that 1mo in and just had my first week full in business and $317.00 after taxes that will buy next weeks fuel and food. I hope to get enough for the following weeks expences just to keep the doors open. shoe string budget it nerve racking, But I've never felt more alive. But this all will work it way out as I get better at this business. Just keep my fingers crossed. I think I got about 10-12 notts tied in the shoe string from where it broke and try not to pull it so hard to re-tieing-it. Mike

hey Cracker.....
im in the same boat man...maybe not 0$, but not far from it.....
had some big life changes not to far back, and simply put my foot down and decided to take matters into my own hands again
it sounds like your head is in the right place, or at least headed in the right direction...
there are tons of good knowledgeable people on here that when combined, corral a massive base of experience and know how...
theres even a group of us on here that have the "blue collar" "been there and done that" sort of knowledge for fabrication, plumbing, gas, electric, and so on... and several are always willing to lend advice and help out when needed.
lol, the lists of do's and dont's can be overwhelming sometimes, this is a good place to get things hashed out and at the very least get pointed in the right direction.....
@Mike- lol, sounds like we have the same shoe strings !! personally, i think thats awesome for a first week out, i bet you that doubles in no time....and then doubles again in just a little time........lol, this time next year your going to be hiring help! you have got a great gig there, your one of the ones i look up to and hope i can do justice to my venture like you have yours..... 

If I can help in anyway at all other than green backs just ask. lol, Its only fair to give back to the ones thats come and ask as I did. And thank you Backalleyburger for your vote of confidence. Last Saturday I had a lot of customers say that they had seen me the first weekend and that they were in the wrong lane to stop and made it a point to stop this weekend. Now if I can get repeat customers that means I'm doing it right. But time will tell. Cracker75 Like Back alley says there more knowledge here than Carter got pills as they say. I'd say a lot of us here have step off the deep end once or twice and on paddle to hold on too, but you learn something about yourself in the prosess. just try to keep on level ground even jf it's on your tiyi toes with water at your nose...

Thanks for the responses guys, but for me, a multi-year build is out of the question. I live in a very small community and would need to make as much form the "novelty bump" of opening as possible. If it took me 5 years, the community response would be: "It's about freakin' time, this better be good....".
 
I do have a lot of ideas I need to put on paper, and a lot of information still to gather.
 
 

Cracker...
no multi years here, ive been hard and heavy at it for about two months now, i should be opened up and ready to go right about the heat of the summer....
 
and i agree, that novelty bump is hopefully going to put me in the black again in short order

i say at it hard and heavy..... the first month was mostly design, research, marketability studies, the basic discovery stages,  etc.....  but all a necessary step in the process .....
and now were in our rainy season so im getting about 2 honest days out of a week right now..... of course when things dry up and the heat sets in a month from now, i'll be complaining about the drought............lol, but with the latest curve ball ive thrown myself, that may be a good thing....... more details to come 

BAB, your post got me thinking about timing. It seems like unless somebody offered me $50K today, this season is out. Opening in the fall risks business-suicide, so I have a year to collect information, plan, and find funding. 
 
 

So the "general plan" has a lot of components. Each one will be described individually, any comments or criticism is welcome. Nothing is set in stone.

cracker75

BAB, your post got me thinking about timing. It seems like unless somebody offered me $50K today, this season is out. Opening in the fall risks business-suicide, so I have a year to collect information, plan, and find funding. 

Sounds like you have your head on straight. I like reading everything you've written so far.
I did a little homework on Lopez Island so now I understand your situation a little better. 2200 Year round residents -that's a small customer base. Looks like heavily dependent on seasonal summer traffic, aka tourists & day visitors. Short selling window. Impulse buyers. Gotta shoot the ducks when they're flying and then only with one shot!
I'm looking forward to learning more about your plans. I'm a small business consultant with over 40 years of sales, marketing and operations experience. Everything I do on here is Pro Bono.

cracker75


So the "general plan" has a lot of components. Each one will be described individually, any comments or criticism is welcome. Nothing is set in stone.

totaly agree with nothing set in stone....... i have what i think could be called 3 distinct selling seasons around here, and a game plan for each one should i get delayed into another "season"
right now im gearing up for the summer "fresh squeezed lemonade/cold sandwiches" season summers here are down right brutal.....
in a few months i will be revamping with "coffee/hot chocolate/chili/hot sandwiches" for the fall festival season......
and then there is the "military season".... it goes year round, lol
and as the first year goes by, there will be tweaking and refining, i will pay attention to what works, what doesnt, and the reasons why, and have a better plan of assault laid out for next year as to what im going to "specialize" in
 
 
 
 

cracker75


BAB, your post got me thinking about timing. It seems like unless somebody offered me $50K today, this season is out. Opening in the fall risks business-suicide, so I have a year to collect information, plan, and find funding. 

 
no chance of getting your feet wet with chilis and chowders this fall ?...... do you have an end of year festival season before everyone disappears for the winter?
 
2200 locals huh, pretty much everyone knows everyone else..... might not be a totally bad thing if your on good terms with everyone, maybe service the bar(s) around town...... cater boating traffic maybe..... just how shut down do you guys get around there ??
how far are you away from the naval bases ?

A few hours have passed since my last post, and I've already re-thought it.
 
The summer season is important, tourist dollars and all that, but more so because I wish to schedule multi-week specials based on available products sourced locally. We have a fair amount of farmers here (both produce and livestock), and a community that is very supportive of the local/organic movement.  It would be foolish not to take advantage of such beautiful produce during the high season. 
 
As for the sales aspect, this plan will be predicated on winter survival, and a strong local repeat customer base (I will expand on this later when I discuss marketing). My theory is that if I can build an operating system that breaks even or profits (including my wage) during the worst months, everything else is just extra money.
 
Should I manage to create such a system, the initial years profits will go to debt-repayment, and after that I actually have a "phase two" expansion goal. Profits are not optional. 
 
So how do you get enough business to support yourself during December with only 2200 mouths, most of them broke? I am of the opinion, that even with our 8 restaurants, there is an unrecognized opportunity created by the recession (it literally took two years to reach us), that all of our local operators are unable to take advantage of because of their overhead. If I play my cards right, I believe I can meet or beat the quality of my competitors, at a substantially lower cost.
 
As I said, there are a number of discreet components that make up "my plan", and if I just start babbling on about it, it will be too much, too quick, and difficult to make sense of. 
 
The next post will be (unless I'm trying to answer questions) the description of the idealized "Place". Location, look and feel.
 
After that is The Kitchen, The Order Entry System, Menu, Advertising/Promotion, Additional Revenue Opportunities....and maybe a few other subjects. 
 
PS: I really appreciate the feedback. The above questions should be answered in detail under the different subject topics later.

Oh, before I go any farther, anybody got any thoughts on the letter to the HD?
 
Found out today....they have no email contact on their website, so snail-mail it is. LOL.
 
I was planning on keeping it simple and seeing what they send back, I want fully-equipped concession trailer (possibly including a functioning commercial dishwasher), hooked up to power, water, and sewer/septic. I want it licensed as a commercial kitchen, not a mobile or temporary unit.

what are you going to do about restrooms ? 

BackAlleyBurger


what are you going to do about restrooms ? 

 
I think that will be up to the HD. I would prefer to just start with a porta-potty (HD could require it be handi-accessible, which costs more). It's about $100-$125/mo. 
 
We have very little actual county-sewer-service. Most  any building uses a septic tank. If I can locate on a property that has a septic system that will handle the additional load, I can provide restrooms. If I have to locate without it, I have to compare the costs of regular grey-water disposal, and porta-potty rental, versus installing a tank (which also requires the property owner to approve it, but most owners wouldn't mind a free septic system as it improves the value of their property). 
 
The real answer is: I don't know. The HD and county zoning regs will define what I do and how I do it.
 

cracker75


Oh, before I go any farther, anybody got any thoughts on the letter to the HD?

Found out today....they have no email contact on their website, so snail-mail it is. LOL.

I was planning on keeping it simple and seeing what they send back, I want fully-equipped concession trailer (possibly including a functioning commercial dishwasher), hooked up to power, water, and sewer/septic. I want it licensed as a commercial kitchen, not a mobile or temporary unit.

Sounds then like you'll be dealing with not only the HD but also the Building permits and zoning people. I suggest checking into the building ordinances and zoning regs before you get too far down the road. Being the type of eco-conscious community it sounds like you're in I would guess the codes are pretty strict. I suspect that you're walking a fine line between a permanent verses a temporary/mobile classification for zoning adherence. I'd go see them in person verses snail mail. It makes it more high touch and gives you a better chance of getting a favorable response.

Foodbme

Sounds then like you'll be dealing with not only the HD but also the Building permits and zoning people.....

 
I'm willing to bet I'll be going back and forth from one agency to another before I know exactly what I'm allowed to do. I suspect it will much more similar to the red-tape party a brick and mortar establishment needs to get open, but that's OK. I have no interest in skirting the rules, in my fantasy, my operation will be the poster-child of professionalism.

So to begin with...."The Place"
 
This is the hardest part for me, because I have a very specific location in mind, without which, I will need to reconsider the entire plan.
 
The look/feel I'm going for will be similar to most other operators, a trailer, some picnic tables, and probably some landscaping to make it a pleasurable place to be during the good season. 
 
The property is a whole 'nother thing. Lopez is divided, by it's residents, in half. The north-end, and the south-end.  Nearly all the commerce is is located on the north-end, in what we call "the village". 7 of the 8 restaurants are there, along with the grocery store, post-office, bank, and knick-knack shops. One restaurant is on the south-end, but it changes ownership every 24 months, and I'm pretty sure no one has figured out how to make it profitable. However, in the middle of the island, is the school, 2 mechanics, and the hardware store. These all sit on "center road", the primary conduit for all traffic going from one end of the island to the other. Also the fastest way from the middle or south-end of the island, to the ferry landing, which is at the northern-most tip of the rock.
 
So what we have today, is an area with tons of built-in traffic, and zero food-service. Considering the nature of the traffic, quick-food is the best way to capitalize on it. Also, the village is slightly offset from the main routes around the island, most ferry travelers would welcome an opportunity to pick up some food on the way to the boat, without taking a detour through town. 
 
In this area there is about 9 properties that would suit my purposes. All of them residential/agricultural. So getting permission for commercial food production will be challenging. Also getting an owner to rent some space for a reasonable price, will be challenging. So will getting access to utilities. All of which needs to become known before I can start asking for money.
 
And the hardest part? Secrecy. I suspect that after I have asked 3 people questions in regards to this endeavor, word will begin to spread. It's that small. After that I have a limited window to get from fantasy to reality. So how to get answers without going public is a big concern for me. These answers will greatly impact the viability, and if it turns out that I cannot get what I need, for the price I need it to be profitable, the plan will get nixed.
 
So I think my first step will be to contact the HD, and see what they will require for me to get the license I want. After that I can open negotiation with land-owners on the sly, and if I can get permission and price, then I go to the zoning/building/permit agency to see what kind of hoops they want me to jump through. 
 
Really, very little of this will be up to me, so I just have to do my best to get the answers I want, and if it looks promising, I can begin talking to other people and get ball-park estimates on utility hook-ups and the like. Lots of initial infrastructure......hmmmmm, things might get bumpy.....

As you recognize, there are many hurdles.v You can forget about secrecy. If all of the sites are residential/agricultural, that may require zoning changes and zoning hearings. Your cover is blown. You'll get resistance from existing food establishments, especially if your building is non-conventional.
Where the Hardware store and mechanics are---Is that zoned commercial? I'd go check out a zoning map and pinpoint the areas that are zoned commercial to avoid a variance hearing.

Can I spell out a photobucket link to show an aerial view of the location?
 
 

Ignore the previous post. I'll think this over. I don't think re-zoning will be in order, just a different "current-use classification. My establishment will not encompass an entire property, just a small portion.
 
Need to figure out how to answer this question without raising more questions. 

I do appreciate the feedback Foodbme.

if you keep the trailer "mobile" then i would think you could get around any zoning changes as well...... mobile can still be set up to look perm or semi perm....
ive seen coffee trailers that were drive thrue and even had curbing to define the drive thrue lane.......
 

Sorry it took me so long to get back, other things in life have needed my attention.
 
Though the specifics of "the place" will involve a lot of players, my vision remains constant. I know exactly "how" it will be. I just do not know how I will get it there. Lucky for me, most of that will be decided by bureauocrats .
 
Moving on the "the kitchen", I want to outline what I want (and don't want).
 
When I browse Ebay,  CL, or new concession trailer manufacturers sites, one thing I constantly see, is kitchens designed for people who have never worked in kitchens. Also, I notice that most of them are designed from the standpoint of a 2-3 person daily operation. In my fantasy, my gig will be operated by one person alone, for 9 months out of the year. So to meet this goal, I will need an extremely "fast" kitchen, and in my experience, this is completely defined by equipment, and equipment proximity. 
 
The downside of utilizing higher-grade gear to expedite production is cost, yet that cost would be replaced by labor if ignored, and paying someone else to help me run the rig is an indefinite cost, whereas equipment is a fixed cost. 
 
So I would prefer to spend more on gear, and less on employees. 
 
Looking at typical trailers, I have to say I am unimpressed. Since I cannot post links yet, I'll just send you to the one outfit that I think builds incredibly fast kitchens-on-wheels:  Armenco Food Trucks. Just google it. 
 
Those rigs blow me away. 
 
The short list for primary hotline equipment is as follows:
8 burner hotplate
24" grill
24"-36" griddle
48"-60" cold top (sandwich prep fridge)
3 bay steam table
hot food pass-thru merchandiser
giant coffee urn (1.5 -3 gallon)
salamander
convection steamer
double-stacked 1/2 size convection ovens
6-drawer chef base under grill/griddle/hotplate
 
I hope I am not breaking some unspoken law of roadfood by not including a fryer, but the truth is, I've worked without one for over 12 years and do not miss them one bit. 
 
In my imagination, the hot and cold equipment would be parallel (with the exception of the convection ovens, they can be vented directly and do not require a hood), all of which would be perpendicular to the steam-table/sales window located at the end of the trailer. 
 
Trying to explain what I  imagine without pictures or at least drawing is difficult, and in the future, I will try to get up some rough sketches (I am slowly learning google sketch-up)
 
Ideally, this trailer would be better-equipped than average, and substantially smaller. Though I haven't touched on the prep area, dry, refrigerated and frozen storage,  or the ware washing area, these are all also on the list. This particular post is just to describe the functioning hotline, and design goals. 
 
If I could sum it up, my kitchen goals are: speed, efficiency, and cleanliness. I know it sounds pompous, but I am looking to be the pinnacle of professionalism. And that starts with a professional kitchen.

Cracker, Armenco builds some very good kitchens. I worked for a movie caterer for years, we had 3 trucks built by them.
Another good mfgr is Wyss catering trucks, we also had 3 built by them, and I thought they built a better truck. They have a better roof system too, no leaks.
Both of these guys are VERY expensive.
Check out West Coast Trailer, they built my trailer, and understand the  L&I regs and all that is required for Washington.
Price wise, he was mid ground for what I wanted, after 1 1/2 yrs, I'm still happy with the rig and nothing is falling apart.
I looked at many trailers, the craftsmanship in most were crap.
You will be required 5 sinks,  (3 bay dish with drain boards, produce, and hand sink, all indirectly plumbed with p-traps, The hand sink can use a direct line to the waste tank.
 
I run a one man show during the week, only have cashier help when I move for an event.
What size trailer are you looking at? You will be hard pressed to get all that in anything less than 22-24 ft.
 
As far as fryer.... depends on the menu. some days I don't use mine, others it's getting heavy use. I would not have a trailer with out one.

Thanks for the links chefbuba, those are some fantastic kitchens. 
 
Here's something I would like a little feedback on: The equipment I want comes at a premium, I think if I asked a new trailer manufacturer to spec it out with my equipment list, we'd be pushing $75-$100K. That's out of the question. 
 
One thing I am cognizant of, is that for me to attract investment capital, I need my assets and liabilities to be closely aligned. Basically, I need to be able to liquidate my entire operation, for about the same amount I owe on it, creating a "capital safety net" for my investors. 
 
So, I was wondering what everybody's thoughts were on used equipment. I could purchase it locally, over time, and the have a trailer builder spec out the trailer to what I have (and local codes). The trailer itself is probably the most rapidly depreciating asset of the bunch, but in order to conform to ever-changing code, new guarantees approval, where used may require (expensive) modifications.
 
When I see the equipment I want on CL or Ebay, going for prices substantially lower than new, I know that the resale of the equipment itself is marginal, so why spend a ton on it in the first place?
 
I understand that used gear may require repair, but other than that, does this sound like a stupid idea? New trailer, and used gear?

What are you doing that you need a salamander, steamer,
 2 convection ovens, 8 burners, 3 hole steam table?
Ditch the urn, add a bunn and brew into an air pot for a couple hundred.
You are going to be into it for more than 75 with all that stuff.
Look at this thread, there are a bunch of pics of my trailer.
It's 20' and no wasted space.
I wanted a chef base under the broiler and an under counter freezer at the right side of the serving window, but I was at my budget. Those things will come at a later date.
There is a slicer next to the fryer and shelving above the sinks. I rarley use my steam table.