Unpasteurized Cider

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Greymo
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Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 8:49 AM
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Yesterday, while at the "apple farm", we purchased a couple of gallons of cider............................it is so good!   Of course it is extra good because the state of Maryland does not require cider to be pasteurized.  For the first time, I noticed a small warning label at the bottom of the label that it was not pasteurized and might be harmful to one's health.  I could not believe that it is required for them to put this on a jug of cider!
 
Can you  buy unpasteurized cider in your state?  There certainly is a big difference in the taste.

pacman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 9:43 AM
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I think we can, but, it is hard to find.    Everything I've seen in grocery stores is pasteruized ... YUK....might as well buy apple juice!!!!   Once in a blue moon I find it if I'm traveling and run across a fruit stand that's open.



Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:09 AM
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You can in Ohio.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:18 AM
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We get ours at A & M Farm Orchard in Midland Ohio - on the jug it says "Meets All Food Safety Standards" - and it is delicious!

Here is  a link to this wonderful place - it is a slideshow showing various facets of the store and tent area:

http://s417.photobucket.com/albums/pp260/radians2009/Mediterranean%20Restaurant%20and%20Cafe%20Wilmington%20Ohio/A%20and%20M%20Farm%20Orchard%20State%20Route%20251%20Midland%20Ohio/?albumview=slideshow

It is between Mt Orab and Wilmington on State Route 251 just off State Route 68, if you are in the area.  At $4.00 a gallon it is a real bargain and it lasts two weeks in the refrigerator.
<message edited by NYPIzzaNut on Tue, 09/29/09 10:23 AM>

Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:32 AM
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In the Northeast, New York and, I'm almost certain, New Jersey bans the sale of all untreated cider.  Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania all permit it.  The federal government requires a warning label on untreated cider sold directly to the public but permits the sale.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:34 AM
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There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.

NC Cheesehead
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:46 AM
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NY Pizza,

2 weeks?  A gallon of that stuff wouldn't last 2 days before it was gone from my fridge.  I love real fresh squeezed non pasteurized cider.

I remember once when I was a kid when a childhood friend of mine had a gallon of that stuff in the fridge that obviously was well past it's due date.  We drank some of it and we were feeling a bit "loopy."  At the time, we were too young to realize we had just drank "cider wine."

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:52 AM
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Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


In the Northeast, New York and, I'm almost certain, New Jersey bans the sale of all untreated cider.  Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania all permit it.  The federal government requires a warning label on untreated cider sold directly to the public but permits the sale.

The last time I was in Connecticut they'd banned the sale of untreated cider.

Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 10:55 AM
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NYPIzzaNut


There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.


The state may not require a warning label, but the federal government does require it.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:11 AM
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NC Cheesehead


NY Pizza,

2 weeks?  A gallon of that stuff wouldn't last 2 days before it was gone from my fridge.  I love real fresh squeezed non pasteurized cider.

I remember once when I was a kid when a childhood friend of mine had a gallon of that stuff in the fridge that obviously was well past it's due date.  We drank some of it and we were feeling a bit "loopy."  At the time, we were too young to realize we had just drank "cider wine."


I got 2 gallons last Thursday and we are on the second gallon now.  We had talked about freezing it but we both knew we could finish it well before that time.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:13 AM
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Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.


The state may not require a warning label, but the federal government does require it.

Then they must have an exemption.


Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:14 AM
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Michael Hoffman


Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


In the Northeast, New York and, I'm almost certain, New Jersey bans the sale of all untreated cider.  Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania all permit it.  The federal government requires a warning label on untreated cider sold directly to the public but permits the sale.

The last time I was in Connecticut they'd banned the sale of untreated cider.


See: http://www.cga.ct.gov/2008/rpt/2008-R-0522.htm: the 10/1/08 report says that 19 producers in the state sell unpasteurized cider.

Greymo
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:15 AM
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According to the label on my gallon of cider, it states that the FDA requires it so how would one state be expempt?

Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:16 AM
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NYPIzzaNut


Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.


The state may not require a warning label, but the federal government does require it.

Then they must have an exemption.


They don't have an exemption.  A & M Farm Orchard pasteurizes their cider.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:17 AM
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Maybe in farm areas it is not required.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:21 AM
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Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.


The state may not require a warning label, but the federal government does require it.

Then they must have an exemption.


They don't have an exemption.  A & M Farm Orchard pasteurizes their cider.
They do not pasteurize it - they use a UV system which does not heat the cider nor affect the taste - that is the other approved option.



Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:27 AM
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NYPIzzaNut


Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


NYPIzzaNut


There is no such warning label needed in Ohio - see my above post.


The state may not require a warning label, but the federal government does require it.

Then they must have an exemption.


They don't have an exemption.  A & M Farm Orchard pasteurizes their cider.
They do not pasteurize it - they use a UV system which does not heat the cider nor affect the taste - that is the other approved option.

You are correct.  UV pasteurization is used by many small producers, because it's much more financially doable, and it's just as effective as heat pasteurization.  Some folks have problems with UV treatment but many people say the product is indistinguishable from untreated cider in taste.

seafarer john
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:29 AM
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The cider we purchase from a local apple farmer here n New Paltz NY is unpasteurized (it says so on the label) and contains no preservatives - And it is delicious  - changing flavor thru the season as new varieties are added to the mix.

We left a half gallon out in the sun  last week and it took on a bit of an alcohol edge and was slightly bubbly (the plastic bottle was starting to balloon due to the gas pressure) and it was excellent.

The cider available in the local supermarkets is all pasteurized and has preservatives even though some is locally produced stuff. Maybe farm stands have an exemption here in NYState?

Cheers, John   

WarToad
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:30 AM
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Living life has risks, and if drinking fresh 100% natual unfiltered unpasturized apple juice "might be harmful to one's health" then dammit...  cover me boys, I'm going in.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:33 AM
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seafarer john


The cider we purchase from a local apple farmer here n New Paltz NY is unpasteurized (it says so on the label) and contains no preservatives - And it is delicious  - changing flavor thru the season as new varieties are added to the mix.

We left a half gallon out in the sun  last week and it took on a bit of an alcohol edge and was slightly bubbly (the plastic bottle was starting to balloon due to the gas pressure) and it was excellent.

The cider available in the local supermarkets is all pasteurized and has preservatives even though some is locally produced stuff. Maybe farm stands have an exemption here in NYState?

Cheers, John   
They use the UV method I feel certain.



Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:39 AM
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I guess the real issue, taste-wise, is HEAT-pasteurization, not pasteurization itself.  As I understand it, seafarer john's New Paltz cider has to be pasteurized, by NYS law, but if they use a UV system then it is not heat-pasteurized.  Next time you buy a jug, ask them - I'd bet they say they use UV.

NC Cheesehead
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:45 AM
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WarToad


Living life has risks, and if drinking fresh 100% natual unfiltered unpasturized apple juice "might be harmful to one's health" then dammit...  cover me boys, I'm going in.


Agreed 100 percent.  So what's next?  Will we have to figure out a way to make fresh fruit and vegetables safe as well?  I mean come on....enough already.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:47 AM
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Bruce Bilmes and Sue Boyle


I guess the real issue, taste-wise, is HEAT-pasteurization, not pasteurization itself.  As I understand it, seafarer john's New Paltz cider has to be pasteurized, by NYS law, but if they use a UV system then it is not heat-pasteurized.  Next time you buy a jug, ask them - I'd bet they say they use UV.

I had no idea about this til you brought up the matter so I called A & M and learned about this alternative UV system, that is approved by state and federal authorities.


Bruce Bilmes and Susan Boyle
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 11:57 AM
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The problem is in the processing.  You may get sick from a bad apple or head of lettuce, but it's just you and, maybe your family or guests (and you're likely to reject a piece that is rotting or otherwise in obviously bad shape).  But press that one bad apple with thousands of others and you contaminate the whole batch, which will be consumed by many, many people.

The same thing happens with commercially-ground beef, which is why it's gotten harder to find a rare burger in restaurants.  One contaminated batch gets mixed with thousands of pounds of good beef, contaminating the whole batch.  If you grind your own beef, a rare burger is much safer - you're only at risk if the particular piece you're grinding is contaminated.

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 12:31 PM
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I'll be damned! They told me when I went to buy cider that state law prohibits selling unpasturized cider.
 
Thanks.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 12:42 PM
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Actually I guess if you want to get technical:

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118770599/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0



<message edited by NYPIzzaNut on Tue, 09/29/09 2:07 PM>

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 12:45 PM
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Furthermore:

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/gmf-agm/appro/dec85_rev_nl3-eng.php

Imprimer | Taille du texte : P M G TG Aide

Ultraviolet light treatment of apple juice/cider using the CiderSure 3500

Novel Food Information


Health Canada has notified Moore Orchards that it has no objection to the sale of unpasteurized and unfermented apple juice and cider products which have been treated with the CiderSure 3500 Ultraviolet (UV) light unit. The Department has conducted a comprehensive assessment of UV treated apple juice/cider according to its Guidelines for the Safety Assessment of Novel Foods. These Guidelines are based upon internationally accepted principles for establishing the safety of novel foods.

Background:

The following provides a summary of the notification from Moore Orchard and the evaluation by Heath Canada and contains no confidential business information.

1. Introduction

The CiderSure 3500 UV light unit has been developed to treat apple juice/cider with UV light to reduce the levels of microbial pathogens in juice products. The intent of the CiderSure 3500 is specifically to reduce the levels of Escherichia coli 0157:H7, an organism linked to various food borne outbreaks caused by the consumption of contaminated fresh apple juice/cider.
The assessment conducted by Food Directorate evaluators determined the effectiveness of the CiderSure 3500 UV light unit in reducing the bacterial load of apple juice/cider, how the composition and nutritional quality of UV light-treated apple juice/cider compares to untreated and pasteurized apple juice/cider, and the potential for toxicological or chemical concerns associated with the use of UV light on apple juice/cider.
Apple juice or cider treated with UV light to reduce the levels of microbial pathogens is considered a novel food according to part (b) of the definition of novel food, i.e.
"b) a food that has been manufactured, prepared, preserved or packaged by a process that
a. has not been previously applied to that food, and
b.causes the food to undergo a major change;"
Here the major change is in the microbiological safety of the food.

2. Description of the Novel Process

The CiderSure 3500 unit uses UV lamps to expose a thin film of apple juice/cider flowing through tubes under turbulent conditions. Sensors monitor the amount of UV light that is being applied to the juice/cider and a computer interface determines the appropriate flow rate to achieve a significant reduction in the microbial load of the juice/cider based on this UV penetration data. The UV unit is programmed to compensate for differences that may exist in apple ciders such as total solids and colour as increased solid content and darker colour due to extended storage of apples that can decrease UV penetration.

3. Microbiology

Ultraviolet light has been extensively used for more than 40 years as an effective treatment for the elimination of various microorganisms in water. Wavelengths of UV light in the range of 200 to 280 nm have been demonstrated to effectively inactivate bacteria and viruses due to DNA mutations induced by the absorption of UV light by DNA molecules.
The petitioner has presented data demonstrating the reduction of E. coli O157:H7 in fresh apple cider using the CiderSure UV light unit. Raw, unprocessed apple cider inoculated with strains of E. coli O157:H7 were run through the CiderSure 3500 according to the manufacturer's instructions. Analysis of the UV treated cider found that the CiderSure 3500 was capable of achieving at least a 5-log reduction in the levels of E. coli. For safety reasons, a non-pathogenic surrogate E. coli strain which shows almost identical UV sensitivity to the pathogenic strains of E. coli O157:H7, is used to test all production units destined for the marketplace.

4. Dietary Exposure

The majority of apple juice and cider products sold in Canada are pasteurized using heat. A small percentage of these juice/cider products are not pasteurized and are commonly sold at roadside stands, country fairs, juice bars and on ice or in refrigerated display cases at grocery stores. The UV-treated apple juice and cider would be expected to be consumed in the same way as either the pasteurized or unpasteurized products on the market.

5. Nutrition

It is known that only certain vitamins are susceptible to degradation by UV light. The only vitamin of any potential significance in apples would be vitamin C which is not particularly sensitive to UV light. Raw apples, however, contain only a small amount of this vitamin and this is lost readily through exposure to heat, oxygen, and light during processing into juice. It is thus generally accepted that unfortified apple juice, even if unpasteurized, is not a significant source of vitamin C. Thus, the use of UV light treatment is not considered to pose any new nutritional safety concerns.

6. Chemistry/Toxicology

The effects of UV light on the major chemical components of food were evaluated to determine if there was any potential toxicological or chemical safety concerns associated with juice products that have undergone UV treatment. Data provided on photochemistry indicates that the only degradation products that would occur from UV treatment of juice/cider products are those that occur naturally from sunlight. UV treatment of water has been examined by several groups for by-product formation under actual disinfection conditions and studies using the Ames test have failed to find evidence of elevated mutagenic levels in treated waters. The U.S. Code of Federal Regulations contains a section (21 CFR 179.39) devoted to the conditions under which UV radiation may be safely applied to food. Provided the operating conditions of the lamps are within these constraints, there is no objection to the application of this process as proposed.

Conclusion:

Health Canada's review of the information presented in support of the CiderSure 3500 concluded that there are no human food safety concerns associated with the sale of unpasteurized and unfermented apple cider and juice that has been treated with the CiderSure 3500. The UV treatment can achieve a significant reduction in the microbial load of apple juice and cider products. It should be noted that this reduction does not mean elimination of pathogenic organisms, especially in cases where the original microbial load of the juice product was extremely high. Therefore, manufacturers should continue to take steps to limit the risk of contamination in their production process.
This opinion is solely with respect to the suitability of apple cider and juice treated using the CiderSure 3500 for sale as human food. It is the continuing responsibility of Moore Orchards to ensure that its products are in compliance with all applicable statutory and regulatory requirements. Any new information obtained which has potential health and safety implications should be forwarded to Health Canada for our consideration in order to ensure the continued safety and integrity of all novel foods available in the Canadian marketplace. The sale of a food which poses a hazard to the health of consumers would contravene the provisions of the Food and Drugs Act.
Issues related to the labelling of products and potential inspection activities associated with use of this novel process are addressed separately through existing regulatory processes administered by the Canadian Food Inspection Agency.

This Novel Food Information document has been prepared to summarize the opinion regarding the subject product provided by the Food Directorate, Health Products and Food Branch, Health Canada. This opinion is based upon the comprehensive review of information submitted by the petitioner according to the Guidelines for the Safety Assessment of Novel Foods.
(Également disponible en français)
For further information, please contact:
Novel Foods Section
Food Directorate
Health Products and Food Branch
Health Canada
Tunney's Pasture
Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0L2 Telephone: (613) 941-5535
Facsimile: (613) 952-6400

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 12:48 PM
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And from NY State:

http://www.nyapplecountry.com/cider.htm

Fresh pressed New York State apple cider is available all year long. Look for refreshing cider at your local farm market or supermarket. Remember that fresh cider can be used in many cooking recipes
.

Is Cider Pasteurized or UV Treated?

Most New York State cider is either pasteurized or treated with Ultra Violet (UV) light. Both processes are approved by the Food and Drug Administration, (FDA).
The pasteurization process involves heating the freshly pressed cider to 160 degrees for a few seconds. The high temperature kills bacteria that might be there. The cider is then immediately cooled to prevent it from getting a "cooked" taste. This process is the same process used to pasteurize milk. When done properly, pasteurization does not affect the flavor of the cider. Consumer tests have indicated that people cannot tell the difference between the flavor of pasteurized and un-pasteurized cider. Also, the nutritional value does not change. Some people simply prefer to drink fresh cider without any heat treatment or added preservatives.
UV treatment is a non-thermal process that meets FDA guidelines to obtain a 5- log reduction of pertinent pathogens. This is equivalent to 99.999% safe. The UV or Ultra Violet treatment has the cider pass by an ultraviolet light which kills harmful bacteria. This process is called non-thermal because it does not heat up the cider. It is FDA approved and an equally safe alternative to heat pasteurization.
The New York Apple Association recommends drinking only pasteurized or UV treated fresh apple cider. This is to ensure that all consumers both young and old are protected against possible illness. Approximately 95% of the volume of cider currently produced in New York State is either pasteurized or UV treated.




Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 12:53 PM
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Just out of curiosity, why did you decide to violate a copyright by posting that report/abstract on Roadfood and opening up Roadfood for a lawsuit?

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 1:07 PM
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Should I just post the link to it do you think (like members do here regularly and frequently to copyright protected sites and data?)

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 1:31 PM
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NYPIzzaNut


Should I just post the link to it do you think (like members do here regularly and frequently to copyright protected sites and data?)


Here's the way it works: It is permissible to post 10 percent of a copyrighted work or 500 words, whichever is less, as long as you provide attribution. The safest way to post something that is copyrighted is to post an attributed sentence or two along with a link.

Greymo
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 3:02 PM
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Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 3:04 PM
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Indubitably.

seafarer john
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 6:27 PM
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While I thank NYPIN for posting that report, I'm not about to read the whole damn thing and I doubt that more than two other roadfooders are up to the punishment - so I don't think copywrite infringement is a big deal in this matter.

Cheers, John 

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 09/29/09 7:06 PM
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seafarer john
 

...  so I don't think copywrite infringement is a big deal in this matter.

Cheers, John 

It is if you're the one being sured.


WarToad
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 3:56 PM
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Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 4:06 PM
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WarToad


Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.

My father used to stick jugs of cider in a snowbank in our yard and it wouldn't be long before we had great hard cider.
 

saps
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 4:44 PM
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You don't need to answer Hoffman.  If he were truly concerned, he would have PM'd you instead of trying to make you foolish.

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 5:49 PM
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saps


You don't need to answer Hoffman.  If he were truly concerned, he would have PM'd you instead of trying to make you foolish.

Just exactly whatinhell are you talking about?


WarToad
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 6:06 PM
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Michael Hoffman


WarToad


Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.

My father used to stick jugs of cider in a snowbank in our yard and it wouldn't be long before we had great hard cider.
 


That would have then been unpasturized cider with natural yeasts still alive.

Greymo
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 6:22 PM
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Michael Hoffman


saps


You don't need to answer Hoffman.  If he were truly concerned, he would have PM'd you instead of trying to make you foolish.

Just exactly whatinhell are you talking about?

 
                    
I think it means that poor Saps has no sense of humor,  or else  had too many  pre-dinner cocktails.


Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 7:07 PM
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WarToad


Michael Hoffman


WarToad


Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.

My father used to stick jugs of cider in a snowbank in our yard and it wouldn't be long before we had great hard cider.



That would have then been unpasturized cider with natural yeasts still alive.

Oh, right. I wasn't suggesting you could do that with pasturized cider. I was just talking about what my father used to do.


rebeltruce
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 10/1/09 8:19 PM
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My Pap used to sit a couple jugs out on the backporch, a week or so and look out! He'd poke some holes in the lids so that the jugs wouldn't explode.

A glass or two and all was right with the world.....LOL!

eruby
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Fri, 10/2/09 8:41 AM
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The excellent unpasteurized cider at Baugher's in Westminster, MD has this:
 
"FDA required warning: This product has not been pasteurized and, therefore, may contain harmful bacteria that can cause serious illness in children, the elderly, and persons with weakened immune systems."
 
 
 

Greymo
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Fri, 10/2/09 8:49 AM
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Baughers   is  where we purchased our cider the other day.  We picked  60 pounds of apples first which is really fun for the kids.  They were ready for cider after all that picking!

mjambro
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Mon, 10/5/09 3:50 PM
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Picked up my second gallon ($6) of unpasturized cider of the season at Phantom Farms in Cumberland, RI this past week.  Simply Outstanding.  I was curious to see if the second gallon would be as good as the first.  It was.

Ran out mid week and bought some pasturized cider from Jaswells at a local grocer.  After having the real stuff, it was a poor substitute.

NYPIzzaNut
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Mon, 10/5/09 6:06 PM
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Our gallon of UV treated cider at A & M Farm Orchard in Midland OH goes for $4.

Greymo
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Mon, 10/5/09 6:15 PM
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I believe that we pay $4.95 for  our cider and it  is worth every penny.  The kids had it this morning with pancakes and their grandfather's pure New York State maple syrup.
<message edited by Greymo on Mon, 10/5/09 6:16 PM>

Michael Hoffman
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Mon, 10/5/09 7:21 PM
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Greymo


I believe that we pay $4.95 for  our cider and it  is worth every penny.  The kids had it this morning with pancakes and their grandfather's pure New York State maple syrup.


Why did they take their poor old grandfather's syrup away from him?

tmiles
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Mon, 11/30/09 3:33 PM
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We have been buying fresh unpasturized cider from Dartmouth Orchards on Westport Rd in Dartmouth, Mass. In this state unpasturized cider can be sold direct retail only (no wholesale or resale). It is an excellent product, and got better as the season went on. The Thanksgiving product was great. They are open up through Christmas.

I still have our old press, and may start making cider again next year. I had been under the (wrong) impression that I had to pasturize for all sales. 

UncleVic
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Tue, 12/1/09 12:00 AM
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WarToad


Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.


Then after 2 weeks, give it a good pinch of yeast nutrient, 1 cup of sugar, and buzz would be an understatement a couple weeks later!!

Thats one thing I miss about Michigan, my buddies apple orchard... No more fresh squeezed cider.. No more fresh off the tree apples for pie.. (and neither was UV, Pasteurized or Pesticide treated).

Are there apple trees in Florida, or am I stuck fermenting oranges and mango's now??

rebeltruce
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Thu, 12/3/09 6:22 AM
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I've got 5 gallons of Apple Wine or Apfelwein going now, along with a 5 gallon batch of sweet cider should end up tasting simliar to Hornsby's, and a 5 gallon batch of a recipe called Thor's Hammer.

Pasteurization doesn't really affect fermentation...it's the preservatives you've got to watch out for. So long as your cider or AJ only contains juice, and vitamin C you are set to go. It can even be from concentrate, although 100% juice not from concentrate is my choice.

tmiles
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Re:Unpasteurized Cider - Wed, 12/9/09 10:39 AM
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UncleVic


WarToad


Greymo


Does anyone know if the  "uv treated" cider fements like the unpasteurized does?

Add a dash of champaign yeast and give it 2 weeks in a cool basement, you'll have your buzz going in no time.
 ....
Thats one thing I miss about Michigan, my buddies apple orchard... No more fresh squeezed cider.. No more fresh off the tree apples for pie.. (and neither was UV, Pasteurized or Pesticide treated).

Are there apple trees in Florida, or am I stuck fermenting oranges and mango's now??

Apples will grow as far south as Orlando (at least) if you plant "low chill" kinds. Most of them were developed in Israel. "Anna" and "Ein Shemir" (sp?) are two of the most popular. You will need to plant 2 (3 is better) for pollination. Several companies specialize in low chill apples.