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 Greatest all-around football player

Change Page: < 12 | Showing page 2 of 2, messages 31 to 46 of 46
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saps

  • Total Posts: 1551
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  • Location: wheaton, IL
Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/2/09 2:01 AM (permalink)
Mosca


I still disagree. Baugh was a great athlete, and a great all-around player... but if you transplanted him to today's game, would he be as great as Deion Sanders? If you transplanted someone from today like Hines Ward back to Baugh's time, would he outshine Baugh?

My point isn't that Baugh wasn't great, nor is it that today's athletes are all better; my point is that, while it might be natural to try to answer the question of greatest all-around football player, the question itself is flawed, and ultimately impedes real understanding of the game and its history by oversimplifying it. In otherwords, it is a fun exercise, but measures nothing.

 
Thanks for pointing that out.  I actually though this was serious, and to be honest, this thread was impeding my understanding of the game until you pointed that out.  You are much wiser than anyone here.
 
Now, back to measuring nothing.
 
It would have been interesting to see how Manning would have played if he didn't spend the majority of his career running for his life or looking out of the earhole of his helmet.
 
Payton was the best player I ever saw.  Would have loved to see him run behind Emmitt Smith's line.  Smith was still a Hall of Famer, but Aikman and Irvin shouldn't be in.


 
#31
    the ancient mariner

    • Total Posts: 3987
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    Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/2/09 10:19 AM (permalink)
    Mosca----I have decided that you must be right and my opinion is worthless.  So what ?  I also have decided that you are, or have been a teacher.  You sure impressed me.  I had to take Rowan and Martin's advise and look up a few words in my trusty Funk and Wagnall.  Or,  maybe your a politian --- you sure dazzled me with fancy phrases---well anyhow ----

    just maybe---

    Slingin' Sammy wasn't as fast as Deion but he played 60 minutes not 15, with no face mask and no steroids, he holds records for passing and punting that Deion could never compare with, only read about.  He also kept his mouth shut and just did his job of running the Redskins -- oh, don't forget he called all the plays, both offensive and defensive and never had to check with the bench to see if he was doing it right.  And he never danced to  the music of his own ego---just did his job and did it better than anyone.  Trippi was close Joe. 

    Now Miss Clara-----mon petite fleur, you and your dad are right.  Jimmy Brown was a fantastic athlete, but he was just a runner.  In High School in Glen Cove LI he played every sport. He was the best lacrosse player in the country in HS and in College----he could have starred in baseball, or basketball -----like Bo Jackson and others he was a great athlete---------But he was not the greatest Football Player ------and neither was Joe Montana, or Lawrence Taylor or Jerry Rice or anyone else----that honor belongs to the great Slingin' Sammy Baugh. 

    Gentle people---I rest my case-----football is over til next year
    Pitchers and catchers report in 2 weeks. 
     
     
     
    #32
      Mosca

      • Total Posts: 2934
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      Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/2/09 12:01 PM (permalink)
      I didn't mean to tick anyone off. I was adding what I thought in the interest of stretching the discussion beyond naming this guy or naming that guy. I wrote what I thought and gave a reason why I thought that. If I upset anyone, oh well. I was hoping for a reasoned rebuttal to my point. I'm sure there is one out there somewhere, beyond the bruised feelings.
       
      #33
        Baah Ben

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        Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/9/09 4:31 AM (permalink)
        Clara - I will always remember listening on the radio to the epic battles that took place between the NY Giants and the Cleveland Browns.  The ones that took place in the snaow were the best!!

        Most of the games were on radio.  Marty Glickman announced many of them.  A different game in a far different world.  Sam Huff, Andy Robestelli, Lou Groza, Bobby Mitchell, Gifford, Tittle, Summerall, amazing........

        Your Dad (sorry he's not still around) and I will have to disagree.  I'm sticking with Jimmy Brown..OJ a very close second. JB was the best I have ever seen.

        I feel very lucky to have lived long enough to not only experienced sports in the 50's and 60's, but sports of today as well.

        I'm fairly certain you can get on the Internet and go back to the 50's and 60's and get the rosters of most of those teams...For those of you as old as I am.....Great memories...

         
        #34
          Mosca

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          Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/9/09 8:41 AM (permalink)
          Baah Ben

          I'm fairly certain you can get on the Internet and go back to the 50's and 60's and get the rosters of most of those teams...For those of you as old as I am.....Great memories...


          http://www.pro-football-reference.com
           
          #35
            Bill Reynolds

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            Re:Greatest all-around football player Fri, 02/13/09 11:19 PM (permalink)
            Walter Peyton
             
            #36
              improviser

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              Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 02/16/09 4:33 PM (permalink)
              claracamille


              Baah Ben


              Ancient..I'm going with Jimmy Brown.

               
              Baah Ben,
               
              If my dad was still around he would disagree with you that Jim Brown was the greatest all-around football player.  I grew up in West Virginia & in the 1950's & early to mid 1960's, the only pro football games we could watch would be the Cleveland Browns. 
               
              I can still here my dad fussing & fuming about Jim Brown.  He always said Jim Brown was a great running back, but he never blocked or did anything but run  the ball.  He also did not like it when Jim Brown sauntered back to the huddle, he wanting him to hustle and not just stroll.
               
              As for myself, I always thought tight ends were the best all around players.  Since, I am from Indianapolis & may be prejudiced but I think Dallas Clark, tight end for the Colts is one of the great all around players.


              As it happens, I just watched Spike Lee's documentary Jim Brown: All-American. In it, Jim discusses his slow walks back to the huddle. According to him, he decided to walk slowly back to every huddle after a tackle as a strategy. He figured if he walked slow after every tackle every time, the opposing team would never be able to figure when he was actually hurt. A little bit of a mind game.
               
              I'd recommend the movie, by the way. While I think the movie lets Jim's past regarding domestic violence go by without much comment, it told me a lot about Jim Brown that I never knew before, especially about his activist work.
               
              #37
                joerogo

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                Re:Greatest all-around football player Sun, 11/20/11 9:33 AM (permalink)
                Trippi, still going strong at 90.
                 
                #38
                  chewingthefat

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                  Re:Greatest all-around football player Sun, 11/20/11 12:20 PM (permalink)
                  My favorite is Albert Haynesworth, wonderful human being, right up there with Michael Vick!
                   
                  #39
                    MetroplexJim

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                    Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 11/21/11 10:21 AM (permalink)
                    BioTeacher


                    Some of the best of the best come from Mississippi
                        Quarterback- Eli Manning, Archie Manning, Brett Farve
                        Wide Reciever- Jerry Rice
                        Running Back- Walter Peyton
                        Punter- Ray Guy

                    BioTeacher

                    As we have expanded the discussion to include a little "regional pride", how about these quarterbacks who were born and raised in PittsburghJohnny Unitas, Joe Namath, Joe Montana, and Dan Marino (just to name a few).
                     
                    The Steelers are still kicking themselves for passing on Marino who was available to them in the 1983 draft.  Most would agree that they would have won multiple more SB's with Marino succeeding Bradshaw. 
                     
                    You mentioned Ray Guy.  So did Terry Bradshaw on the Fox pre-game show (11/20/2011).  He was campaigning for Guy to be voted into the HOF.  I agree.  Even though this topic is about the "all-around" and it's hard to argue for anyone but Sammy Baugh, I'd nominate Guy to be on the "super-human team" along with Jim Brown, Joe Greene, Walter Peyton, Lance Alworth, Deion Sanders, Lawrence Taylor, and Joe Willie Namath (when he still had knees and before he "teamed up" with Johnnie Walker!).
                    <message edited by MetroplexJim on Mon, 11/21/11 10:56 AM>
                     
                    #40
                      Davydd

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                      Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 11/21/11 12:08 PM (permalink)
                      chewingthefat


                      My favorite is Albert Haynesworth, wonderful human being, right up there with Michael Vick!

                      And no consideration for Randy Moss?
                       
                      #41
                        mayor al

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                        Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 11/21/11 1:56 PM (permalink)
                        Mine votes are divided as well.. but by 'playing style or descriptor' rather than geography or one massive 'vote'.
                        Winner of the 'Classic Back' has to go the Walter Payton on my list.
                        Winner of the 'Old Timers Name who pops up often as 'the Great' Paul Hornung (sp?)
                        Winner of the Grizzly Bear Attack descriptor would be Dick Butkus or Aleix Karrus (remember Brazing Saddles!)
                        Team Leader is a tough one. Payton Manning would be in the top group with Johnny U and Roger Staubach. Undersized /overachiever at quarterback has to be Eddie LeBaron. Y A Tittle was my first NFL hero so I would add him to the quarterback top 5 etc.
                        A real gentleman on and off the field is Morehead State graduate and former N Y Giants Quarterback Phil Simms. Perhaps not in the 'Greatest Athlete' group, but as a person who remembers his roots, they don't come any better than Simms. I like to think of Tittle and LeBaron and Simms and Manning (amoung others) everytime some low-life, overpaid, and over media-hyped thug, gets some award for being able to do his Community Service as part of some plea-bargain.
                         
                        #42
                          Michael Hoffman

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                          Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 11/21/11 3:22 PM (permalink)
                          joerogo


                          Trippi, still going strong at 90.


                          Fantastic!
                           
                          #43
                            trzhotel

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                            Re:Greatest all-around football player Mon, 11/21/11 5:17 PM (permalink)
                            Pele, Maradona, perhaps even Zidane. Don't overlook Cristiano Ronaldo by the time his career is over either.
                             
                            #44
                              carlton pierre

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                              Re:Greatest all-around football player Tue, 11/22/11 8:16 AM (permalink)
                              Baah Ben


                              Ancient..I'm going with Jimmy Brown.


                              I'll second the nomination for Jimmy Brown.  He was awesome and could do it all.
                               
                              #45
                                MetroplexJim

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                                Re:Greatest all-around football player Tue, 11/22/11 10:37 AM (permalink)
                                carlton pierre


                                Baah Ben


                                Ancient..I'm going with Jimmy Brown.


                                I'll second the nomination for Jimmy Brown.  He was awesome and could do it all.


                                Awesome, absolutely!  (See my "superhuman" category above).
                                 
                                But I do not recall him passing, kicking, or playing defense.
                                 
                                Hell, the "knock" on him when he was playing was that he didn't block for $h*t.  I have no doubt that he could block, but he just didn't care to -- and said so!!!
                                 
                                #46
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