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 p30 build - ventilation design

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DWags541

  • Total Posts: 174
  • Joined: 2/25/2012
  • Location: Eugene, OR
p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 5:24 PM (permalink)
Hey Everyone,
I am doing a food truck build and currently in the design phase. I've scanned through a lot of posts by current members and have some questions, some that may have been asked before, and also some offerings from my own experiences.
 
I just wanted to throw out there that a free program called google sketchup can be very useful for designing a 3d model of your build. It takes a little time to get used to it, but once you do, it is pretty user friendly. As I get site permissions, I will post my images and models for you all to browse and comment on. For now, I guess I'll try to find another host for images.
 
Right now, I am working on the ventilation aspect of the build. At first, I figured on having an 8' hood with AC exhaust fan on the side of the van (interior length 10' 10"), but one metal guy I ran the idea past brought up the issue of roof weight and overall structural integrity, as well as the integrity of the roof (leaks). This was a previous consideration, but I didn't see any other way at the time. Now, I am looking into wall mounted ventilation. I've seen this style incorporated on Southern California food truck builds. Most of those have their griddle at the back of the truck and wall fans mounted above it, pushing exhaust out the back. Presumably, these are 12v fans, which I would find ideal for my setup.
 
I've seen some discussions and links to fans, on sites like global industrial <sp?>, and the southern cali truck builder pages. I also saw a couple members using 120v fans, presumably with inverter systems or ultimately for use with onboard generators. Since my truck is small, I am not considering a generator and I am favoring a battery bank. I imagine I will use an inverter or at least have it available. I know 12v fans are used with RVs and there is also the option of car radiator fans (12v).
 
I know a lot of these build projects are done with keeping costs down. But has anyone considered incorporating a 12v RV fan like MaxxFan into their build? I have two of these that I purchased when I had a different design in mind. And I know I will use them at some point for something if not for my exhaust ventilation in my truck. One potential argument I could see is that there are plastic or polycarbonate components to the MaxxFans. I would be curious to know if they would or could hold up. I also considered just mounting them on my roof for extra ventilation, as they are designed for roof mounting, I would expect the integrity of the roof (leakage) not to be affected. Just wondering if people have researched this option. Paperwork on my MaxxFan (Deluxe model 7000-7500) says at high speed, it can move over 900 cfm, 1223 rpm, using 4.2 amps. The model I have has motorized opening and closing vent cover which I think is nice. But ultimately, I don't want to marry the idea of having these in close proximity to food cooking exhaust and discover later that they do not clean well, or hold up to higher temps. (btw, regarding temps, I would imagine these RV fans have to hold up to high heat experienced in a van that has the greenhouse effect going on inside of it during the summer)
 
Anyway, whats the word on 12v motor fan operations for wall mount ventilation? Has anyone gone this route? I suppose buying the supplies from that company Armenco or Pacific Food Trucks is ideal because it is what they use. My BTUs are going to be about 60,000. I researched that one needs 100 cfms per 10,000 BTU.
 
Thanks for input. I look forward to contributing to these forums.
 
Dave
 
Chevy p30, 1985, interior L:10' 10" W:6'6" H:~6'4"
<message edited by DWags541 on Sat, 02/25/12 5:48 PM>
 
#1
    Dr of BBQ

    • Total Posts: 3716
    • Joined: 10/11/2004
    • Location: Springfield, IL
    • Roadfood Insider
    Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 5:35 PM (permalink)
    first welcome to RF. Do a search here there has been a ton written about 12 volt fans including links and pictures. You'll love those threads, and they are very recent also.
     
    #2
      Vic Cardenas

      • Total Posts: 177
      • Joined: 2/9/2012
      • Location: Midvale, UT
      Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 5:51 PM (permalink)
      Welcome! I bought a 1983 P30 designed by AA cater truck, another large scale So. Cal company. I really like the rear exit hood system. I think it's a really well thought out design, yet simple and cost effective in construction. The fresh water tank is concealed above it in the wasted space. The fan motors are the same that most of those companies sell. I only have one working right now but it flows extremely well. It just sucks everything right out. It seems to flow better than all the hood systems I've seen in restaurants I've worked in. And that's just with one out of two fans functional.  I could probably take pictures of the interior if you'd like.
       
      #3
        DWags541

        • Total Posts: 174
        • Joined: 2/25/2012
        • Location: Eugene, OR
        Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 5:58 PM (permalink)
        I would love pics. I believe the AA cater truck company is one of those s. cali trucks that style their truck ventilation that way.
        I may have seen a link yesterday on their site offering the complete fan system for sale. I'll have to check if I saved the link.
        I am curious how that water tank is mounted. Taking advantage of wasted space is key with smaller trucks. I wonder if yours is similar in size to mine.
        Thanks!
         
        #4
          DWags541

          • Total Posts: 174
          • Joined: 2/25/2012
          • Location: Eugene, OR
          Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 6:02 PM (permalink)
          It could have been pacific cater truck dotcom as well. They seem to have extensive parts. but couldn't locate what I was referring to immediately.
           
          #5
            DWags541

            • Total Posts: 174
            • Joined: 2/25/2012
            • Location: Eugene, OR
            Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 6:11 PM (permalink)
            Definitely pacific cater truck site. Item number MSC-128. Under miscellaneous parts.
             
            They also have 12v fan motors and 12" fan blades under "Electrical" parts.
             
            Anyone used this company? compared prices?
             
            Vic, I am curious if this company's build is similar to what you use.
             
            Thanks!
             
            #6
              Dr of BBQ

              • Total Posts: 3716
              • Joined: 10/11/2004
              • Location: Springfield, IL
              • Roadfood Insider
              Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 9:12 PM (permalink)
              DWags541


              Hey Everyone,
              I am doing a food truck build and currently in the design phase. I've scanned through a lot of posts by current members and have some questions, some that may have been asked before, and also some offerings from my own experiences.

              I just wanted to throw out there that a free program called google sketchup can be very useful for designing a 3d model of your build.

              Dave

               
              Well heck Dave you had me all fired up when you mentioned Google Sketchup. I figured I could do a simple overhead view of my floor plan for the company that I'm buying my floor covering from. I thought that until I read this on one of thier forums: SU does not "draw simple floor plans." It is a 3D modeling tool. If you don't plan to make a 3D model, SU is not the tool for you.
               
              And then I went back and reread your post and it was just as you said 3 D . I need a simple floor plan in jpg that I can add measurements to and email to the flooring material company I'm working with. The floor covering they make is awesome and they are talking like doing a special run so I'd have a single sheet 18 feet long right down the center of my step van. Oh well I'll keep searching.  Here is a link to the company . http://www.oscodaplastics.com
              And for those that want to do a 3D drawing google sketchup is pretty cool
               
              #7
                DWags541

                • Total Posts: 174
                • Joined: 2/25/2012
                • Location: Eugene, OR
                Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 9:18 PM (permalink)
                Well, I believe you can create your sketchup 3d model and then save it as a pdf or jpg for 2d demonstration. Still worth a look. I have done "modeling" in photoshop, which is a great program for lots of things, but I have found it cumbersome for doing scale models.
                One feature of sketchup I really like is they have a tape measure tool where you can refer back to your model and measure out areas for reference when considering reorganizing the space, purchasing and implementing new equipment, etc.
                I might be more critical of it if it were not a free program. But its free, and its great.
                 
                #8
                  Dr of BBQ

                  • Total Posts: 3716
                  • Joined: 10/11/2004
                  • Location: Springfield, IL
                  • Roadfood Insider
                  Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 02/25/12 9:28 PM (permalink)
                  I'm not bad mouthing the program at all. I'm sure some people on here will really like it. I just want an overhead view of my floor including the raised fender wells. The fact that it's free is awesome. I guess I'm going to end up drawing something by hand, but I'd hoped to do something that looked a little more professional looking than that. LOL
                   
                  #9
                    DWags541

                    • Total Posts: 174
                    • Joined: 2/25/2012
                    • Location: Eugene, OR
                    Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sun, 02/26/12 1:36 AM (permalink)
                    Yea, in some respects, Sketchup can be a lot more than you want/need.
                    I've done decent mock ups on graph paper. I guess it depends what the purpose of your model is.
                     
                    #10
                      Bistro a go-go

                      • Total Posts: 171
                      • Joined: 2/22/2012
                      • Location: Columbus, GA
                      Re:p30 build - ventilation design Tue, 02/28/12 9:30 AM (permalink)
                      Im also dealing with this issue. can anyone purchase the side/rear discharge vent system? if yes, where and how much? anyone ever installed one?
                       
                      #11
                        DWags541

                        • Total Posts: 174
                        • Joined: 2/25/2012
                        • Location: Eugene, OR
                        Re:p30 build - ventilation design Tue, 02/28/12 3:28 PM (permalink)
                        I am currently working with Pacific Cater Truck to see if their rear mounted model or a variation of it fabricated locally would do the trick. They use 12v fans in their builds. When I spoke to Zhorzh (pronounced George), he trumped up their popularity as a parts place for many far flung truck builders, as well as their business customizing their jobs at their shop. Seems reasonable as that is their business and building out trucks completely probably yields the most profit for them.
                         
                        I will be happy to share my experiences. There are many skilled metal workers to pick from in my area. I just want to make sure I get the design aspect correct before committing to a plan and expensive materials/parts.
                         
                        Bistro a go-go


                        Im also dealing with this issue. can anyone purchase the side/rear discharge vent system? if yes, where and how much? anyone ever installed one?


                         
                        #12
                          Bistro a go-go

                          • Total Posts: 171
                          • Joined: 2/22/2012
                          • Location: Columbus, GA
                          Re:p30 build - ventilation design Tue, 02/28/12 5:15 PM (permalink)
                          thanks for the offer and yes, VERY interested. wanna make sure it is water proof and gets the grease laden air outa there. I like the look of the louvres over the flying saucer on top and weight on that roof is a no-no. Im looking forward to hearing what you find out. do they sell plans or sell the unit whole and ready to cut and install? or sell components?
                           
                          #13
                            DWags541

                            • Total Posts: 174
                            • Joined: 2/25/2012
                            • Location: Eugene, OR
                            Re:p30 build - ventilation design Tue, 02/28/12 6:51 PM (permalink)
                            Bistro a go-go


                            thanks for the offer and yes, VERY interested. wanna make sure it is water proof and gets the grease laden air outa there. I like the look of the louvres over the flying saucer on top and weight on that roof is a no-no. Im looking forward to hearing what you find out. do they sell plans or sell the unit whole and ready to cut and install? or sell components?

                             
                            I would guess components and whole unit.
                             
                            #14
                              daddywoofdawg

                              • Total Posts: 299
                              • Joined: 2/23/2011
                              • Location: Starkweather, ND
                              Re:p30 build - ventilation design Wed, 02/29/12 5:30 AM (permalink)
                              They have a one piece unit and they have parts.
                               
                              #15
                                edwmax

                                • Total Posts: 2016
                                • Joined: 1/1/2007
                                • Location: Cairo, GA
                                Re:p30 build - ventilation design Wed, 02/29/12 8:38 PM (permalink)
                                Dr of BBQ


                                DWags541


                                Hey Everyone,
                                I am doing a food truck build and currently in the design phase. I've scanned through a lot of posts by current members and have some questions, some that may have been asked before, and also some offerings from my own experiences.

                                I just wanted to throw out there that a free program called google sketchup can be very useful for designing a 3d model of your build.

                                Dave


                                Well heck Dave you had me all fired up when you mentioned Google Sketchup. I figured I could do a simple overhead view of my floor plan for the company that I'm buying my floor covering from. I thought that until I read this on one of thier forums: SU does not "draw simple floor plans." It is a 3D modeling tool. If you don't plan to make a 3D model, SU is not the tool for you.
                                  ....

                                Sketchup has a steep learning curve for 3D.    ... But if you are going to draw by hand, I think you can easily & quickly use it for 'single-line' plan drawings.   These plans can be easily rotated to an iso style plan.    This would also, get some familiar with the basics to use 3D.
                                 
                                #16
                                  Dr of BBQ

                                  • Total Posts: 3716
                                  • Joined: 10/11/2004
                                  • Location: Springfield, IL
                                  • Roadfood Insider
                                  Re:p30 build - ventilation design Wed, 02/29/12 9:06 PM (permalink)
                                  Edwmax,
                                  I appreciate that but I'm going back to the same system that I used when I built my trailer. I already have the equipment in my garage and I'm going to finish the floors and walls first. Then I'm going to put all the equipment in the way I think it should go and move it all at least 3 times. Then let it sit for 3 or 4 days and finally move it once more (back to where I started) and then I'm done. LOL On the floor covering layout I have a friend that is doing that for me. But thanks for the encouragement.
                                   
                                  One thing I would like to encourage builders to take into consideration is never put your sink directly across from your service window. You don't want your customers to see that area if you have dirty pots and pans stacked up. And the area under a sink tends to get unsightly so keep all that out of view if you can.
                                  <message edited by Dr of BBQ on Wed, 02/29/12 9:10 PM>
                                   
                                  #17
                                    Bistro a go-go

                                    • Total Posts: 171
                                    • Joined: 2/22/2012
                                    • Location: Columbus, GA
                                    Re:p30 build - ventilation design Sat, 03/10/12 11:17 AM (permalink)
                                    what is the ventilation system in your trailer? is it louvered style? post pics pls?
                                     
                                    #18
                                      DWags541

                                      • Total Posts: 174
                                      • Joined: 2/25/2012
                                      • Location: Eugene, OR
                                      Re:p30 build - ventilation design Wed, 03/14/12 4:23 AM (permalink)


                                       
                                      The fans I settled on. I bought two 12v motored fans for installation. I could not find specs exactly on the motor, but I did find them on the fan blade, which I'll list. This may give clues to the capacity of the 2 speed motor.
                                      Blade Material Blade Width (In.): 5-9/16
                                      Bore Dia. (In.): 5/16
                                      CFM @ 0.000-In. SP: 833/584
                                      CFM @ 0.125-In. SP: 703/376
                                      CFM @ 0.250-In. SP: 565/61
                                      Max. RPM: 1725
                                      Number of Blades: 3
                                      Pitch (Deg.): 25
                                      Propeller Dia. (In.): 12
                                      Required HP @ Higher RPM: 1/40
                                      Required HP @ Lower RPM: 1/100
                                      Rotation: CW Facing Discharge
                                      RPM High: 1550
                                      RPM Low: 1050
                                      Weight: 0.80
                                      <message edited by DWags541 on Wed, 03/14/12 4:29 AM>
                                       
                                      #19
                                        Bistro a go-go

                                        • Total Posts: 171
                                        • Joined: 2/22/2012
                                        • Location: Columbus, GA
                                        Re:p30 build - ventilation design Wed, 03/14/12 8:48 AM (permalink)
                                        im more concerned with what the fans mount to...?
                                         
                                        #20
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