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 when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder?

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1bbqboy

  • Total Posts: 4542
  • Joined: 11/20/2000
  • Location: Rogue Valley
when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sun, 04/4/04 3:33 AM (permalink)
Is it the amount of ingredients, the thickness of the broth, the meat used, or is it the area of the country you live in? Chowders use a milk base(right?), but what makes a soup?....and what makes a stew?.......and where do beans; navy, pinto, black, etc.
enter into the fray?
 
#1
    tiki

    • Total Posts: 4135
    • Joined: 7/7/2003
    • Location: Rentiesville, OK
    RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sun, 04/4/04 8:16 AM (permalink)
    to me---when you place a full ladle of stew in a bowl--the top is mounded,with chunks of ingrediants glisening with sauce,when you do the same with soup--its flats-a lake into which you can dip a spoon and lift out tender peices of ingrediants. So if you make a soup that packed with big chunks it MAY end up a stew! and of course Chowda is white!!
     
    #2
      Alexander

      • Total Posts: 164
      • Joined: 2/27/2004
      • Location: Columbia, SC
      RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Mon, 04/5/04 7:53 AM (permalink)
      My rule of thumb:

      Stick a spoon or fork in it - if the spoon takes 4 or 5 seconds to fall, it's a soup. If it takes 10 seconds or more to fall over, it's a stew. If it takes less that 3 seconds to fall over, throw the mess out and start over. Thickening with flour is cheating.
       
      #3
        olphart

        • Total Posts: 289
        • Joined: 12/29/2003
        • Location: Bastrop, TX
        RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 06/23/04 7:11 PM (permalink)
        GF makes "Green Chili Stew" much like they make at Pancho's Mexican Buffet. They call it a stew, and GF calls it a stew. But it looks like a soup to me. We make our own broth from chicken bones and leftovers, then she adds chopped potatoes, onions, pork, canned tomatoes and Retell tomatoes, and, of course, coarsely chopped canned green chilies. The spices include homemade chili powder and kosher salt. The result is something akin to beef soup, only with pork.
         
        #4
          6star

          • Total Posts: 4388
          • Joined: 1/28/2004
          • Location: West Peoria, IL
          RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 06/23/04 8:45 PM (permalink)
          According to the free dictionary ( http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ )a chowder must have milk, potatoes, and onions in it. However, the line between a soup and a stew by their definitions seems to be very vague, soups being thinner and stews being thicker. (But then you have oyster stew, which is relativelythin, and cream of mushroom soup, which can be relatively thick, certainly thicker than oyster stew). They say you should STEW the meat to make a stew, but then they mention a vegetable stew. So probably Alexander's spoon definition is as good as any, but just don't bet any money on which is called what!
           
          #5
            1bbqboy

            • Total Posts: 4542
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            • Location: Rogue Valley
            RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Tue, 12/14/10 7:13 PM (permalink)
            Posole  is which one of these?
             
            #6
              MiamiDon

              RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 6:01 AM (permalink)
              6star


              According to the free dictionary ( http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ )a chowder must have milk, potatoes, and onions in it. However, the line between a soup and a stew by their definitions seems to be very vague, soups being thinner and stews being thicker. (But then you have oyster stew, which is relativelythin, and cream of mushroom soup, which can be relatively thick, certainly thicker than oyster stew). They say you should STEW the meat to make a stew, but then they mention a vegetable stew. So probably Alexander's spoon definition is as good as any, but just don't bet any money on which is called what!

              The free dictionary seems to be worth what one pays for it.
               
              Manhattan Clam Chowder, Rhode Island Clear Clam Chowder and Bahamian/Florida Conch Chowder don't have milk.
               
              #7
                ann peeples

                • Total Posts: 8317
                • Joined: 5/21/2006
                • Location: West Allis, Wisconsin
                RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 6:53 AM (permalink)
                Posole seems to be defined as both a soup or stew made with pork.Every recipe and defination I looked up said as much. We served a posole at work yesterday which was definately more on the lines of a stew.
                 
                #8
                  edwmax

                  • Total Posts: 2015
                  • Joined: 1/1/2007
                  • Location: Cairo, GA
                  RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 7:37 AM (permalink)
                  MiamiDon


                  6star


                  According to the free dictionary ( http://www.thefreedictionary.com/ )a chowder must have milk, potatoes, and onions in it. However, the line between a soup and a stew by their definitions seems to be very vague, soups being thinner and stews being thicker. (But then you have oyster stew, which is relativelythin, and cream of mushroom soup, which can be relatively thick, certainly thicker than oyster stew). They say you should STEW the meat to make a stew, but then they mention a vegetable stew. So probably Alexander's spoon definition is as good as any, but just don't bet any money on which is called what!

                  The free dictionary seems to be worth what one pays for it.

                  Manhattan Clam Chowder, Rhode Island Clear Clam Chowder and Bahamian/Florida Conch Chowder don't have milk.

                   
                  hummm ... the Conch Chowder that I had in Florida (years ago) did.   But I'm not sure what a Bahamian Conch Chowder is.  ....    All the recipes that I've seen and/or eaten for Manhattan Clam Chowder was a milk/cream base chowder, but also had tomato or tomato paste added.
                   
                  #9
                    saps

                    • Total Posts: 1551
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                    • Location: wheaton, IL
                    RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 1:54 PM (permalink)
                    When you eat it, it's a soup.  When it comes back up, especially with other things, it's a stew.
                     
                    #10
                      boyardee65

                      • Total Posts: 1457
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                      • Location: Surprise, AZ
                      RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 2:28 PM (permalink)
                       I consider Posole as soup. There may be lots of stuff in it but the broth is usually thin. I have had several versions of this dish all over the southwest having lived here most of my life. All include white hominy, onions, green chile, and pork of some sort. I have seen variations that have tomatoes, tomatillos, tripe and other organ meats. It is regarded here as a mythical hangover cure as is menudo. Very popular on the weekend menus around here.
                       
                      David O.
                       
                      #11
                        chewingthefat

                        • Total Posts: 6093
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                        • Location: Emmitsburg, Md.
                        RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 5:51 PM (permalink)
                        saps


                        When you eat it, it's a soup.  When it comes back up, especially with other things, it's a stew.
                        [/quote
                        Very clever and funny!!
                         
                        #12
                          Greymo

                          • Total Posts: 3663
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                          • Location: Marriottsville, MD
                          RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 6:42 PM (permalink)
                          My  definition of stew is something that has been thickened with  flour .
                          I consider soup  to  have a thin liquid base.  (but Oyster stew is not thickened and still called  oyster stew)   I guess it does not matter as long  as it is  good!
                           
                           
                          #13
                            chewingthefat

                            • Total Posts: 6093
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                            RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 9:29 PM (permalink)
                            Greymo


                            My  definition of stew is something that has been thickened with  flour .
                            I consider soup  to  have a thin liquid base.  (but Oyster stew is not thickened and still called  oyster stew)   I guess it does not matter as long  as it is  good!

                            \

                            Thank you, soup/stew Greymo!

                             
                            #14
                              PapaJoe8

                              • Total Posts: 5504
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                              • Location: Dallas... DFW area
                              RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Wed, 12/15/10 9:57 PM (permalink)
                              You gotta draw a line in tha sand somewhere. I'm not sure where that is though. Gimmy a bowl of it and then I'll decide. :~)
                              Joe
                               
                              #15
                                EdSails

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                                • Joined: 5/9/2003
                                • Location: Mission Viejo, CA
                                RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Thu, 12/16/10 12:06 AM (permalink)
                                As much as we like to make fun of Rachael Ray, her"stoup" (or is it "stewp") word does make a lot of sense. And we haven't even touched upon temperature yet to help with the determination. There are plenty of cold soups, but who ever made a cold  stew? Gazpacho si, cold vegetable stew NO!!
                                <message edited by EdSails on Thu, 12/16/10 3:23 AM>
                                 
                                #16
                                  Foodbme

                                  • Total Posts: 9552
                                  • Joined: 9/1/2006
                                  • Location: Gilbert, AZ
                                  RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Thu, 12/16/10 12:29 AM (permalink)
                                  If a spoon stands up in it, it's a stew. If the spoon falls down, it's a soup! Simple as that!
                                   
                                  #17
                                    Davydd

                                    • Total Posts: 6222
                                    • Joined: 4/24/2005
                                    • Location: Tonka Bay, MN
                                    RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Thu, 12/16/10 10:47 AM (permalink)
                                    If you can eat it with a fork and mop it up with bread it is stew.
                                     
                                    #18
                                      BillyB

                                      • Total Posts: 2851
                                      • Joined: 2/4/2009
                                      RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Thu, 12/16/10 11:19 AM (permalink)
                                      Greymo


                                      My  definition of stew is something that has been thickened with  flour .
                                      I consider soup  to  have a thin liquid base.  (but Oyster stew is not thickened and still called  oyster stew)   I guess it does not matter as long  as it is  good!




                                      I make a cabbage soup thickened with Flour and a potato soup or any soup thats started with a Bechamel base sauce..............What about a Cioppino (fish stew) or a Bouillabaisse (seafood stew)................
                                       
                                      #19
                                        Michael Hoffman

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                                        RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Thu, 12/16/10 2:50 PM (permalink)
                                        A soup is always a soup, a stew is always a stew and a chowder is always a chowder.
                                         
                                        And that's the way it is -- Rachael Ray notwithstanding.
                                        <message edited by Michael Hoffman on Thu, 12/16/10 2:52 PM>
                                         
                                        #20
                                          MiamiDon

                                          RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Fri, 12/17/10 7:32 AM (permalink)
                                          hummm ...
                                           
                                          Manhattan Clam Chowder - Doubleday cookbook and Joy of Cooking:  no cream or milk
                                           
                                          Conch Chowder - In South Florida and the Keys, normal conch chowder has no dairy products.  I have encountered a conch chowder one (1) time in a restaurant that had a dairy product in it.  That was at the Pier House in Key West, and it was notable because virtually nobody serves it that way.  Normal SoFla & Keys conch chowder is often referred to as Bahamian because it is strongly associate with Bahamian immigrants who came to Florida in the 1800's. 
                                           
                                          A quick reference and history:  http://whatscookingamerica.net/History/Chowder/ConchChowder.htm
                                           
                                          I pulled out from my files restaurant conch chowder recipes, also
                                           
                                          La Concha
                                          Bull Peacock
                                          Conchy Joe's
                                          Ziggy's
                                          Monty Trainer's
                                           
                                          Not a drop of cream or milk to be found!
                                           
                                          Of course, I will concede that just because in New York City (where I was born) Manhattan Clam Chowder has no milk or cream in it, or that in South Florida (where I have lived for 33 years) Conch Chowder has no milk or cream in it, that doesn't mean that the Georgia Manhattan Clam Chowder or the Georgia Conch Chowder doesn't either.  It must be a regional thing.
                                           
                                          #21
                                            edwmax

                                            • Total Posts: 2015
                                            • Joined: 1/1/2007
                                            • Location: Cairo, GA
                                            RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Fri, 12/17/10 8:44 AM (permalink)
                                            As I said. the conch chowder that I eat in Florida did have milk/cream.   ... Nothing Georgia about that.    ... I do know that most Clam or conch chowders are potato or potato soup based chowders.   I don't remember the conch chowder (???) I had while on St. Johns, Vi. very well, but it didn't milk, potatoes or tomatoes in it.   ... There was a killer Lobster Bisque made with heavy cream/milk on St Johns.  I have imitated that a few times using clams, shrimp, scallops; ... a sea food bisque.
                                             
                                            I've always though the difference between regular chowders & Manhattan style Chowders is the addition of tomatoes or tomato paste.
                                            <message edited by edwmax on Fri, 12/17/10 8:45 AM>
                                             
                                            #22
                                              BelleReve

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                                              • Location: New Orleans, LA
                                              RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sun, 12/19/10 2:41 PM (permalink)
                                              Add the term bisque to cofuse things even more .
                                              I have cookbooks with recipes labeled as oyster soup, and oyster stew, which are essentially the same dish - prepared the same way, using the same ingredients.  I ate out and had what was listed on the restaurant menu as oyster chowder, and it was rich, made with cream and butter, that I would have called a bisque, only the oysters were whole.
                                               
                                               
                                               
                                              #23
                                                dimmie2

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                                                • Joined: 12/17/2010
                                                • Location: Marina del Rey, CA
                                                RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sat, 01/8/11 9:28 PM (permalink)
                                                From reading your definitions of stew and soup, I must be way off base.  I've always consider a stew made with any kind of meat.  When I make vegetable soup, it has no meat and is thick enough to serve on a plate with cornbread. 
                                                 
                                                #24
                                                  1bbqboy

                                                  • Total Posts: 4542
                                                  • Joined: 11/20/2000
                                                  • Location: Rogue Valley
                                                  RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sat, 01/8/11 9:46 PM (permalink)
                                                  Now that's interesting.  Would vegetarian chili be considered soup too?
                                                   
                                                  #25
                                                    Foodbme

                                                    • Total Posts: 9552
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                                                    • Location: Gilbert, AZ
                                                    RE: when does a soup become a stew? or a chowder? Sun, 01/9/11 2:07 AM (permalink)
                                                    bill voss


                                                    Now that's interesting.  Would vegetarian chili be considered soup too?

                                                    Nope. Veggie Chili would not be considered worthy of being called anything!

                                                     
                                                    #26
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